Find the latitude of any place.  

Forgive me for being slow to

Forgive me for being slow to get back to your post.

Ive skimmed the FEP (with more studies to come) and I doubt Mastodon et al will implement this. It seems like a breaking change that a big project just couldnt undertake.

Also: I see the mechanism for splitting an identity and recovering if a server goes down, but how is profile data supposed to be synchronized between servers in the first place How does it get distributed

NBA News: Rockets extend Ime Udoka to long-term deal

Udoka and the Rockets Agree To Long-term Extension

Find the latitdue and longitude of any place It'd certainly be a lot more beneficial if it was possible to pressure Mastodon into standards compliance.
But as things are right now, Mastodon and its religiously faithful followers can and do declare Mastodon and the way things are done on and by Mastodon the one and only valid standard. They even declare anything that works differently from Mastodon broken. And they can easily get away with it.
In fact, if certain Fediverse server applications preferred compliance with actual standards to compatibility with Mastodon, it's them who'd be on the losing side whereas Mastodon, where probably over 99% of all content are from within Mastodon itself, won't lose anything. Not unless all those that are perceived as add-ons to Mastodon (Pixelfed, PeerTube, Ghost, Flipboard etc.) follow suit.
But seriously, even if Flipboard changed its ways and went for actual standards compliance even if that meant breaking compatibility with Mastodon, then Mastodon wouldn't be convinced that following standards rather than forcing its own "standards" upon everyone is the better way to go. Rather, Flipboard and Mastodon would accuse each other of being broken by design.
# # # # # # # # # # # Redundancy. Resilience against losing the server that you're on by being on another server simultaneously.
Also, just because you can spread your identity across multiple servers and even server types, doesn't mean you can only have one identity.
Look at me, for example:

That's six fully separate, fully independent Fediverse identities, even though Mastodon and most of the rest of the Fediverse (anything that doesn't understand nomadic identity) perceive them as nine identities. And as you can see, what you may have taken for utter science-fiction two minutes ago is being daily driven in the Fediverse right now. And it has been for well over a decade, for longer than Mastodon has been around.
Why have I cloned my identities For the very reason that was invented in the first place: redundancy. Safety. Always having a live backup. Resilience against servers shutting down or malfunctioning. It was invented because its inventor, the creator and then-still-maintainer of Friendica, kept seeing Friendica users lose everything whenever a Friendica node disappeared. And he understood that the only way to really make an identity resilient against server shutdown is for it to reside on at least two servers simultaneously.
If glasgow.social goes belly-up unexpectedly, you lose everything. Potentially forever. Good luck starting over from scratch.
If hub.netzgemeinde.eu goes belly-up, I lose nothing because I still have the identical clones, live, hot, bidirectional backups, on hub.hubzilla.de.
Tell you what: A while ago, hub.netzgemeinde.eu did go belly-up. The queue worker was so overloaded that the hub was bogged down. Nothing went in, nothing went out. Without a clone, I would have been fscked.
Luckily, I had my clone. I logged into hub.hubzilla.de and used my clone to a) do what I'd normally do on hub.netzgemeinde.eu and, especially, b) alert the admin who was on vacation. He and the Hubzilla lead developer ssh'd onto the server and fixed the issue. This might never have happened, hadn't I had that clone on another server.
So you could:

Oh, by the way: The aforementioned six identites may or may not be all of my Fediverse identities. I may or may not have more than these. You wouldn't be able to tell unless I told you.
CC:
# # # # # # # # # # # # # Es gibt nur leider immer noch die eine ungefhre Hlfte aller Mastodon-Nutzer, die der felsenfesten berzeugung sind, das Fediverse sei nur Mastodon. Darunter sind brigens tatschlich einige, die schon seit Oktober/November 2022 oder noch lnger dabei sind.
Und es gibt die, die der Ansicht sind, da das Fediverse nur fr minimalistisches Microblogging erschaffen wurde, und zwar von Eugen Rochko entweder 2016 oder gar erst 2022 (vorher hatten sie ja noch nie von Mastodon oder dem Fediverse gehrt, also gab es das wohl auch noch nicht).
Das sind die, die Friendica-Nutzern die auf ein reines Mastodon-Fediverse ausgelegte Mastodon-Kultur von Mitte 2022 aufzwingen wollen. Die ihnen bei der Gelegenheit zum einen die mehr als zehn Jahre ltere Friendica-Kultur als auch die Nutzung von locker 80% von Friendicas Features verbieten wollen, weil diese Features im Mastodon-Netzwerk stren, mit Microblogging nichts zu tun haben und daher ins Fediverse nicht reingehren.
Natrlich knnte die Friendica-Softwarefamilie versuchen gegenzuhalten. Das wrde aber nichts bringen.
Erstens kommen wir gar nicht durch. Mastodon macht zwar nur ca. 30% aller Server und zwishcen 60 und 70% aller aktiven Nutzer aus, aber auf Mastodon selbst entfallen geschtzt ber 99% des ganzen Beitragsaufkommens auf Mastodon selbst, und die allerallermeisten Mastodon-Nutzer folgen auch fast ausschlielich anderen Mastodon-Nutzern oder gar tatschlich nur anderen Mastodon-Nutzern.
Zweitens sehen die allermeisten Mastodon-Nutzer Mastodon selbst als den einzig wahren Standard im Fediverse an, und zwar allein qua seines auf Mastodon wahrgenommenen Marktanteils von ber 99%. Was davon abweicht, strt und hat sich anzupassen. Wenn nicht, wird es blockiert. Wren Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) und Forte auf Mastodon sichtbarer, gbe es schon lngst Stimmen, die das Fediblocken ganzer Server von den vieren oder gar der vier als jeweils Ganzes fordern, wenn nicht gar die einschlgigen Blocklists schon entsprechende Eintrge htten wegen "massiver, rcksichtsloser Verste gegen die Fedikette". Eine "Fedikette" wohlgemerkt, die nur auf Mastodon ausgelegt ist.
Und drittens glauben wie gesagt viele, da Mastodon zuerst da war und fast das ganze restliche Fediverse nur aus Add-ons zu Mastodon besteht (z. B. ist PeerTube das YouTube-Add-on zu Mastodon, und Pixelfed ist das Instagram-Add-on zu Mastodon). Friendica & Co. werden als bse Eindringlinge im Mastodon-Fediverse wahrgenommen. Da Friendica und Hubzilla vor Mastodon da waren, wird als komplett unglaubwrdig aufgefat, denn wie kann etwas vor Mastodon im Fediverse gewesen sein, wenn Eugen Rochko mit Mastodon das Fediverse berhaupt erst erfunden hat
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # This would require three things, however.
One, any Fediverse server software would have to be capable of altering comments from any Fediverse software. Don't think that posts, comments etc. aren't formatted the same everywhere. They aren't.
For example, Mastodon would have to know and understand that it would have to remove osmamas.to from Misskey, Sharkey, CherryPick, Iceshrimp etc. notes, url=https://mas.to/users/osmaOsma A /url from Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte comments and an invisible shadow mention from (streams) and Forte comments, too.
Two, anyone in the Fediverse would have to always have full and unlimited permission to alter everyone else's content without their consent. This is particularly crucial in the cases of Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte with their highly advanced and fine-grained permissions systems that don't even cover having your content altered by others.
Three, edits on any Fediverse software must always be federated to absolutely everywhere and anywhere in the Fediverse, no exceptions, regardless of software. AFAIK, there is Fediverse server software that still doesn't understand edits at all, and that will either ignore received edits or understand them as and treat them like new posts.
It's very similar to the wish for being able to edit alt-texts into other people's posts which seems to pretty much always come from people who think that the Fediverse is only Mastodon, or at least that everything in the Fediverse is like Mastodon plus one or two extra features.
And let's be honest: If you give especially Mastodon users the ability to alter other people's posts, they will want to alter other people's posts in lots of other ways. Like, delete summaries on Friendica/Hubzilla/(streams)/Forte posts because they're "abuse of the CW field" from a "Fediverse = Mastodon" point of view. Remove all hashtags but four, regardless of these hashtags triggering the automated, individual, reader-side content warnings that have existed in the Friendica family since five and a half years before Mastodon was first published. Cutting "long posts" (= everything over 500 characters) down to a maximum of 500 characters because "the Fediverse was invented by Eugen Rochko for only microblogging". Even removing any and all mentions of the Fediverse beyond Mastodon. Removing text formatting because "it has no place in a Twitter alternative". Or removing all contents from posts or comments altogether.
Of course, the very same Mastodon users will completely flip their shit if a Friendica user comes and copies their 20-post threads into one long post, deletes the contents of the 19 follow-ups afterwards and replaces the content warning in the abstract field (= their CW field) with an actual abstract, just to fit it into a Fediverse culture that's way older than Mastodon itself.
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # #

White Sox 7, Blue Jays 1: So long, streak


Powerslave (1998 Remastered Edition)
Rime Of The Ancient Mariner (2015 Remaster)

YouTube Search:
)

Songwhip:

Lyrics:

Second camping trip of the season! Taking my time setting up and a hedge hog came out to say hello.
Seeing the underside of leaves but I didnt think it was supposed to rain

Cute doggos. Miniature black boxer, practically prancing in black booties. One block later at the fruit monger, full size boxer, heavy, plodding, all white but for one brown eye.

Sounds like Phanpy fixes what Mastodon doesn't even acknowledge as an issue.
But your comment kind of demonstrates to me how not even Hubzilla supports "shadow mentions" (because it didn't need them when it was made, seeing as it supports enclosed threaded conversations): I wasn't notified about your comment, I only saw it as an unread message.
I guess I would have been notified, had I participated in this thread from one of my (streams) channels. (streams) and Forte are more geared towards a Fediverse that doesn't support threaded conversations all over, one that's dominated by Mastodon and mostly used for Twitter-style minimalist microblogging.
Ideally from a Mastodon POV, these "shadow mentions" should include everyone in the current branch of the thread. Ideally from a threaded conversations POV, they should go as far as mentioning all participants in the whole thread. But that kind of "black magic" would scare quite a few Mastodon users out of their minds unfortunately.
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # #
Ich glaube, das geht auch in wenigen Stzen.

Es kommt eben drauf an. Beispiel:
Wenn ich ein Real-Life-Foto habe, und da ist ein Baum drauf, dann sollte auch denjenigen, die ihre Sehkraft verloren haben, einigermaen klar sein, wie der aussieht. Da braucht es nicht viel Beschreibung.
Jetzt habe ich aber Renderings aus obskuren virtuellen 3-D-Welten, von denen hchstens einer von 200.000 Fediverse-Nutzern je gehrt hat. Wenn da ein Baum zu sehen ist, woher sollen die Leute wissen, wie der aussieht, wenn sie ihn nicht sehen knnen Und ich rechne damit, da sie wissen wollen, wie der aussieht, gerade weil sie es nicht wissen.
Das kann einfach ein texturloser brauner Zylinder oder Stumpfkegel mit einem texturlosen grnen Blubb drauf sein wie z. B. in Horizon, wo es mehr auf FPS ankommt als auf irgendwas anderes. Oder so ein klotziges Voxel-Gebilde wie in Roblox, wo das eben der Stil ist. Oder das kann ein 3-D-Mesh aus Blender mit fotorealistischer Rindentextur fr Stamm und ste plus Laub in Form teiltransparenter Oberflchen mit einzeln drauftexturierten Blttern sein, und letzteres ist es dann auch schon mal.
Das ist bei meinen Bildern das Problem: Wer sowas nie gesehen hat, hat keine Ahnung, wie es aussieht. Aber die Chance ist nicht zu unterschtzen, da die Leute auch gerade deswegen neugierig darauf sind, wie es aussieht.
# # # # # # # # # # Hchstwahrscheinlich haben die Macher von Bonfire berhaupt nicht gewut, da es Hubzilla gibt. Ich habe mal eine Umfrage gesehen, da hat jemand auf Mastodon in seiner Bubble gefragt, ob die Leute schon mal was von Hubzilla gehrt haben. Drei Viertel hatten noch nie was davon gehrt. Und wenn jemand Hubzilla kennt, dann ist er hchstwahrscheinlich in einer Bubble, in der Hubzilla an sich bekannter ist.
Ich schtze, selbst heute wissen mindestens 75-90% aller Fediverse-Nutzer nicht, da es Hubzilla gibt, geschweige denn, was Hubzilla kann. (Vielleicht gar nicht schlecht wenn eine kritische Masse auf Mastodon von Hubzilla, seinen Features und vor allem seiner Kultur wte, dann gbe es sicherlich Initiativen zum totalen Fediblocken von ganz Hubzilla.)
Und als Tim Berners-Lee Solid startete, hatte er auch noch nie von Hubzilla gehrt. Jetzt geht er mit voller Absicht in einen direkten Konkurrenzkampf gegen Hubzilla, die er glaubt, mit Marktmacht, groem Namen und Propaganda gewinnen zu knnen.
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # #
from misplacing mentions at start of the reply body text (when a perfectly good mention field exists in the protocol)

Does anything except (streams) and Forte actually make use of these "shadow mentions" AFAIK, Mastodon accepts them, but it can't create them. Due to its total lack of support for threaded conversations, you have visibal mentions eating away your precious character count in order for even only those in your branch of the thread to receive your comment.
That's also why I often have to mention loads of people manually in 100% Mastodon threads: Hubzilla does support threaded conversations, but I think it doesn't support shadow mentions because it has never needed them itself, and it's too old to be designed for a Mastodon-dominated Fediverse.
to inability to remember the readers' position in their (reverse chron and random) timeline.

Maybe it'd also help to move away from Twitter-style doom-scrolling single-message piecemeal timelines as the only option available and towards the same Facebook-style stream with whole threads at once and an unread messages counter with a list of unread messages that takes you directly to each thread with unread messages in it The kind that Friendica has had for a decade and a half now, and that all its descendants have inherited
CC:
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # #
The "can't see all replies" is a deeply hard federation problem but we have an incoming fix for that!

You mean the kind of "fix for that" that Friendica when it was launched into the Fediverse 15 years ago Namely full awareness and support of threaded, one-post-many-comments conversations
Or, better yet, as created by Friendica's creator in his own streams repository, then inherited by his own Forte, then backported to his original creation Hubzilla as per
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Not to my knowledge.
First of all, nomadic identity won't be described in one single FEP that'll cover everything. It was not created on and for ActivityPub. In fact, the concept predates ActivityPub by some six years, and the first implementation predates ActivityPub by some five years.
See, nomadic identity started as an idea. Then Mike built a brand-new protocol around that idea, Zot. Then, in 2012, Mike forked one of his own forks of his own software that is now known as Friendica, originally based on yet protocol designed by himself, and re-wrote the whole thing against Zot. That's how the software was born that's known as Hubzilla now.
As for nomadic identity via ActivityPub, there is only one publicly available software implementation for that. And that's Mike's own Forte. Forte still does everything the Hubzilla/(streams) way which is very very different from how anything else in the Fediverse works, even including Friendica itself, and especially including Mastodon.
Whereas Zot was designed around nomadic identity, ActivityPub isn't. It's having nomadic identity bolted on with a whole slew of FEPs authored by silverpill who is working on converting (typical Fediverse software: built only against ActivityPub, non-nomadic, login/account equals identity) into something that's every bit as nomadic as Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte.
Nomadic identity via ActivityPub was originally silverpill's idea, by the way. And that was in 2023. It turned out that this was actually doable, and so he and Mike started working on it, using experimental "nomadic" branches of Mitra and the streams repository respectively. Their approaches were naturally different: silverpill had to make something non-nomadic nomadic. Mike had to make something nomadic be nomadic using a protocol that wasn't made for nomadic identity.
Not only is silverpill's approach much more difficult because Mitra wasn't made for nomadic identity either, but he also took it upon himself to put everything into FEPs by and by. He is still publishing FEP after FEP. Nomadic identity is quite a complex thing from a "Fediverse equals ActivityPub" point of view it's just that the Hubzilla/(streams) bubble is so used to it whereas silverpill actually has to explore and research something that's natural to Mike.
There's no common set of commands either. There can't be any. Forte, like everything else in the family all the way back to Friendica, is written in PHP. Mitra is written in Rust. Nobody has ever attempted to make something not written in PHP nomadic.
In fact, code sharing would be next to impossible anyway: Forte, like Hubzilla and early Mistpark/Friendika, is published under the MIT license, (streams) is in the public domain, but Mitra is licensed under the GNU Affero GPL v3. Any code coming out of Mitra's conversion to nomadicity would be AGPL-licensed Rust code. And MIT-licensed PHP code that was created when turning Nomad-based (streams) into ActivityPub-based, Nomad-less Forte would be useless for non-nomadic-to-nomadic conversions anyway.
So don't expect any how-to's or the like for converting non-nomadic, ActivityPub-only-by-original-design, login/account-equals-identity Fediverse server software to the same level of nomadicity as Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte until

Seeing as this has been in the making for some two years now, and I don't even know if the experimental nomadic branch of Mitra even allows cloning right now, I guess this will be a long way to go. He may actually first have to change Mitra from the standard Fediverse model of the account and the login being the identity to Hubzilla's, (streams)' and Forte's model of the identity being a container inside your account and one account being able to host multiple such identities. That's because you can't clone logins.
Oh, by the way, nomadic identity is not just about moving. It's not "moving-your-Mastodon-account-to-another-instance on coke". It's way more.
The core feature is cloning. Imagine you have full, live, hot backups of your Mastodon account on one, two, three, four or more other Mastodon instances. Imagine they all have the same identity, based on which one of them is your main instance. Imagine whatever happens on one of them is sync'd to the others in near-real-time. Imagine you can log into either of them and use either of them all the same, regardless of how many and which of the servers are actually online, as long as at least one is.
Moving is actually even more complex than cloning because it involves both cloning and changing the main instance of your identity.
Allow me to illustrate by supposing Mastodon works like Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte:
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Das Posten von Bildern geht auf Hubzilla vllig anders als auf Mastodon.
Auf Mastodon hngst du Bilder einfach als Dateien an deinen Trt dran. Ist so. Geht nicht anders. Wo sie dann auf dem Server landen, weit du nicht, da hast du auch keine Kontrolle drber, ist aber auch nicht dein Bier.
Auf Hubzilla sind da zwei Dinge anders. Zum einen kmmerst du dich selbst darum, wo die Bilder landen. Jeder Hubzilla-Kanal hat nmlich einen eingebauten Cloudspeicher mit eigenem Dateimanager und Unterordnern und Rechteverwaltung und WebDAV-Anbindung und allem Pipapo. In dem landen auch die Bilder, die du posten willst.
Zum anderen funktioniert Bilderposten auf Hubzilla nicht wie auf Twitter oder Mastodon, sondern wie auf einer Website oder in einem Blogpost. Die Bilder werden einzeln in den Post eingebettet, oben oder unten oder mittendrin, beliebig viele davon in einem Post und nicht nur maximal vier. Das heit aber auch, da sie aus dem Cloudspeicher in den Post verlinkt werden.
Noch dazu kriegst du keinen WYSIWYG-Klickibunti-Editor la Word vorgesetzt, sondern du arbeitest mit blankem BBcode. Der kann zwar mit ein paar Buttons generiert werden, du siehst aber nicht den endgltigen Post in Echtzeit entstehen, whrend du ihn baust. Es gibt einen WYSIWYG-Editor, aber der ist optional und standardmig abgeschaltet. Wie gut der ist, wei ich nicht, den habe ich nie benutzt.
Alt-Text ist im Gegensatz zu Mastodon auch kein separates Textfeld. Statt dessen mu er in den Einbettungscode fr das jeweilige Bild per Hand mit reingebastelt werden. In Hubzillas eingebauter Dokumentation ist auch noch nicht erklrt, wie man das macht.
In Kommentaren ist es aktuell noch holpriger. Da mut du erst im Browser in einem neuen Tab deine Kanalseite ffnen, da im Post-Editor das Bild einfgen, das du in einem Kommentar haben willst, den Alt-Text mit reinbauen, den Einbettungscode aus dem Post-Editor rausschneiden, zu dem Tab zurck, wo du kommentieren willst, und den Einbettungscode dann in den Kommentar-Editor unter dem jeweiligen Thread einfgen.
Neben Hubzilla nutze ich ja auch (streams), und genau wie Forte hat es aktuell gegenber Hubzilla beim Posten von Bildern nur vier Vorteile:

Was da aber auch nicht geht, ist, was will: ein Bild kopieren oder als Screenshot in die Zwischenablage holen und direkt in einen Post oder Kommentar reinpflanzen. Also, nicht eine Bilddatei, sondern das Bild, die Grafik an sich. Quasi, wie man auch Bilder in Word reincopypasten kann, wahrscheinlich auch in einen Mastodon-Trt.
Das geht deswegen nicht, weil Hubzilla nur Bilder posten kann, die schon als Datei existieren, entweder auf deinem Rechner (dann werden sie beim Posten in den Cloudspeicher hochgeladen und dann von dem in den Post/Kommentar gelinkt) oder schon im Cloudspeicher auf deinem Hubzilla-Kanal oder (ganz schlechter Stil) von ganz woanders her gehotlinkt.
Damit das geht, was Ulrich will, mte Hubzilla, wenn man ein Bild einfgt, blitzschnell aus dem Bild eine Datei (mit nichtssagendem Namen) generieren, in den Cloudspeicher packen, die Datei genau da, wo man das Bild im Post/Kommentar eingefgt hat, reinbauen und sofort das Bild in der WYSIWYG-Ansicht anzeigen, wenn man die nutzt. Im Gegensatz zu einer Word-Datei kann ein Fediverse-Post ja keine eigentlichen Bildinformationen enthalten.
CC:
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Isn't the A2I post quite a bit out-dated
Some two years ago, I've read about screen readers not supporting more than 200 characters in alt-text. But people who actually use screen readers told me that all screen reader software available has long been upgraded to support an infinite number of characters. And next to nobody uses old versions with a 200-character limit anymore.
And now I often see posts and articles, even recent ones, mention a hard limit of 125 characters for alt-text in screen readers. This must actually be leftover information from the mid-2010s at best.
Case in point: I've never seen anyone in the Fediverse being criticised for what would be absolutely excessively long alt-text by Web design standards. Proof enough that screen readers can easily handle 800 or 1,000 or more characters of alt-text.
As far as I'm informed, the only issue is that screen readers cannot navigate alt-texts, i.e. you cannot rewind to a certain point within an alt-text and have it re-read from there. You can only jump back to the beginning of the alt-text and have the whole alt-text re-read. The longer an alt-text is, the less convenient this is.
By the way: I've started working on an entire wiki on how to describe images properly and write image descriptions in general and alt-texts specifically for the Fediverse. It will take quite a number of existing guides and how-tos and the like into consideration and link to them. It will also take both Mastodon's culture and the special perks of the various places in the Fediverse outside of Mastodon into consideration. When guides contradict each other, I'll mention that as well.
It has to be a wiki because it will contain so much information that it simply wouldn't fit onto one page anymore. Also, I want to be able to point people at certain aspects of describing images or writing alt-texts such as how colours should be described, why people's races should never be mentioned and why explanations do not belong into alt-texts. I don't want to tell them to scroll down to a certain paragraph. I want to show them one page that specialises in that particular topic.
I'm not sure if that's utter overkill, if that'll stand in the way of just "doing it" and actually drive people away from describing images. But in my opinion, someone has to tell people how to do it properly.
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Let's just say the only devs who need full identity portability are silverpill and you, and silverpill is actively working on it.
Then there are Mike, Mario Vavti and Harald Eilertsen who have full identity portability.
All the other devs don't seem to care.
As for the users, however... I guess if Mastodon 4.5 went fully nomadic on Forte's scale, people would kiss Gargron's feet because he'd deliver what they've been craving for for so long. For not exactly few of them, this would be what they've been wishing for for years plus cream and a cherry on top.
And if all the various *keys (at least those that are still maintained) went nomadic on a cross-server-type scale, that'd solve the problem with entire Forkeys going belly-up and leaving its users standing in the rain with unmaintained server software. I mean, I guess we all know how volatile Forkeys tend to be. Not only could people move around from server to server with ease and take everything with them, but they could also try out new Forkeys (this explicitly includes Iceshrimp.NET) and still have clones on longer-lived applications like Sharkey, CherryPick or good old Misskey itself as fallbacks.
In fact, I think one reason for Sharkey's popularity is its import/export capability.
CC:
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Mike himself considers Nomad a legacy protocol now. He has placed all his bets on ActivityPub, and that includes nomadic identity, OpenWebAuth integration and full-blown permissions systems.
What would probably be the most useful for you is documentation is how to take a typical Fediverse project (non-nomadic, only uses ActivityPub, account/login equals identity) and make it nomadic. Including whether to still only allow one identity on each login, or whether to switch to how Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte do it, containerise identities and allow multiple identities on one login (because seriously, that'd make going nomadic a whole lot easier).
Forte could never deliver that, for Forte is the offspring of a family that had been nomadic with identities independent from the account/login for a dozen years when Forte was made.
What you want to do, make non-nomadic ActivityPub-based software nomadic, has only been attempted once: Mitra. And, again, it's in such an early experimental stage that I can't even say whether the nomadic Mitra branch is actually nomadic as in cloneable at this point. I'm actually pretty sure silverpill's FEPs will change over time as he gains experience with making something non-nomadic nomadic.
Don't count on anything being finalised at this point. Not until silverpill merges the nomadic code into a new release or at least declares that his personal daily driver identity is cloned now.
And don't count on anything regarding cross-server-type nomadic identity finalised until silverpill announces having cloned his daily driver identity to Forte, and/or Mike announces having cloned one of his daily-driver channels to Mitra.
If you didn't have Bandwagon already going, if you wanted to start from scratch, my suggestion would be to not start with something basic, non-nomadic, based on ActivityPub and with the identity tied to the account and then see how you can make it nomadic.
My suggestion would be to see if you can do it by making one or multiple add-ons for Forte, (streams) or Hubzilla and putting them into a third-party repository. If that wasn't feasible because you'd need the core to be different, my suggestion would be a soft fork of Forte or (streams), depending on whether nomadicity or a focus on ActivityPub is more important.
Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte are all flexible, multi-purpose and especially modular enough to be able to build almost everything on top of them. Even if you need a different core, all three can be soft-forked. Hubzilla and Forte are under the MIT license, the streams repository contains nameless, brandless public domain software that was made to be forked. And especially (streams) and Forte can profit from 15 years of development and 15 years of experience with daily-driven production servers, accounts and channels. Not to mention that they've got features right now which most other Fediverse devs couldn't even imagine that anything in the Fediverse has them.
In general, starting from zero with nomadic Fediverse server software is nonsense. Starting from zero with Nomad-based software is even more non-sense. Starting from zero with software based on Hubzilla's Zot6 is much more nonsense because Zot6 is hopelessly outdated and on life support because Hubzilla lives on it.
I know this won't help you. It's just what I have to tell those who want to develop new nomadic server software.
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # #
2) None of the solutions feel very approachable. Documentation is thin, and examples are hard to find. Beyond the text of FEP-ef61, where should I go if I want to start building support into my own apps

There isn't much documentation because everything is still very new and also due to the nature of what has already been made with nomadic identity via ActivityPub on which base and which level of stability.
Yes, there's Forte. Yes, it uses ActivityPub for nomadic identity. Yes, it has a stable release.
But: It has never been an ActivityPub project that went nomadic.
It evolved from the Red Matrix (2012)
to Hubzilla (2015)
to some intermediate stuff (2018-2021)
to the streams repository (2021)
to Forte (2024)

So Forte looks back at 13 years of multiple identities per account and nomadic identity. When Hubzilla became the first Fediverse server application to adopt ActivityPub in 2017, the family had already had nomadic identity for over four years.
Implementing nomadic identity via ActivityPub meant switching the whole thing away from a protocol that was built around nomadic identity and over to ActivityPub while keeping nomadic identity.
What you seem interested in is what is working on on Mitra. And that's to take a non-nomadic, ActivityPub-only, account-equals-identity server application and make it nomadic.
AFAIK, this is still highly experimental. It's done in a development branch of Mitra. I know that Mitra understands Forte's nomadic identity, but I can't even say whether that dev branch of Mitra is actually nomadic, as in whether you can clone an identity on one server running the dev branch to another such server and have them sync back and forth.
If anything, this would be what ActivityPub devs looking at nomadic identity should check out. "Would" because it's still in such an early and experimental state that I think there isn't anything worth looking at yet other than how to make your software recognise Forte's nomadic channels as nomadic.
By the way, silverpill is publishing FEP after FEP in which Forte or Mitra, (streams) and Forte are mentioned as implementations at most. So he doesn't just code stuff together, he also tries hard to make it "official" by casting it into FEPs. So I guess he's still figuring out the basics and documenting them rather than getting actual nomadicity to work out of thin air.
You've basically got two options if you want to turn non-nomadic, ActivityPub-only, account-equals-identity software into something that's every bit as nomadic as Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte.
Either you wait until silverpill rolls out the first stable release of Mitra with full-blown nomadic identity of its own. And then there should be quite some documentation on how it was done.
Or you make an experimental nomadic branch of Bandwagon and join silverpill and in getting nomadic identity via ActivityPub going.
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Ideally, they'd flip Mastodon two birds at once and move to somewhere in the Fediverse that not only is not Mastodon, but that's very much not Mastodon. (This is where I really wish there was a native and fully featured iPhone, iPad and Android app for (streams) and/or Forte.)
The problem, however, is that the density of people who think "Fediverse" refers to only Mastodon is very high on mastodon.social, home of newbies, n00bs and those who basically want Twitter without Musk.
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Allow me to take a look at this from a Hubzilla/(streams)/Forte point of view.

The Sin of Overwhelming Complexity: Instance Selection Paralysis


The only way to really combat this effectively is by hiding the whole concept of servers/instances at first, railroading everyone to a server and only letting them know about decentralisation and servers/instances after the fact.
In theory, this could be doable with Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte, and even better than with Mastodon with its themed servers. It wouldn't make sense to offer Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte servers for certain topics or target audiences, seeing as the whole thing would become moot the very moment when you make your first clone on another server. Simply build a kind of "automatic on-boarder" that sends everyone to the geographically closest open-registration server.
In practice, that'd be a bad idea, but for a different reason than on Mastodon. And that's how these servers tend to be very different. Not in topic. Not in target audiences. Not in rules. But in features. Hubzilla is modular, (streams) is modular, Forte is modular, and each admin decides differently on which "apps" to activate. Then you want to join Hubzilla for one cool feature, but the on-boarder railroads you to a server where that very feature isn't even activated.
Sure, the on-boarder could include the option to select certain features that you absolutely must have in your new home and then pick a server that has them. But that'd be extra hassle and extra confusing.
Besides, where'd you put that on-boarder On the official Hubzilla website Haha, no can do. It's all just dumb old static HTML with a CSS. If it's even HTML and not Markdown or BBcode, that is. You couldn't add scripts to it if you tried.
Oh, and (streams) and Forte don't even have official websites. And (streams) will never have one, seeing as it's officially and intentionally nameless, brandless and totally not even a project. Their "websites" are readme files in their code repositories on Codeberg.

The Sin of Inconsistent Navigation: Timeline Turmoil


The streams on Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte are quite a bit different from Mastodon timelines.
First of all, what you usually don't have on public servers is the counterpart to Mastodon's local timeline and Mastodon's federated timeline. On all three, this would be only one stream, the "public stream" or "pubstream". It can be switched by the admin to either what'd be local or what'd be federated. However, public servers usually have it off entirely. Unavailable even to local users. That's because the admins don't want to be held liable for what's happening on the pubstream.
Technically speaking, you only have one stream on a public server, and that's your channel stream. It's much more efficient than a Mastodon timeline because it always shows entire conversations by default instead of detached single-message piecemeal, and because it has a counter for unread messages which even lists these unread messages for you to directly go to the corresponding conversation. But that's another story.
However, your channel stream can be viewed on your channel page, conversation by conversation, or it can be viewed on the stream page as an actual stream with all conversations shown in a feed/timeline-like fashion, one upon another, and with its own set of built-in filters such as "only my own messages" or "only conversations started by members of one particular privacy group/access list" or "only conversations from one particular group actor". It's actually much more convenient than any Mastodon timeline, but for those who want a Twitter clone for dumb-dumbs, it can be very overwhelming.
Yes, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte are much more complex in handling than, say, snac2. But they're also much more complex in features than snac2. That power is their USP. And that power must be harnessed somehow.

The Sin of Remote Interaction Purgatory: Federation Gymnastics


Sure, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte have some of the best built-in search systems in the whole Fediverse. They can pull almost everything onto your channel stream just by searching for it. And if it has replies, chances are they pull these in as well.
But still, they're geared towards desktop users. They still require copy-paste. Phone users don't copy paste. Most of them don't even know the very concept of copy-paste. For most of those who do, copy-paste is much too fumbly if the input device available to them is a 6" touch screen.
You can't blame them, though. This is next to impossible to do any differently. I mean, you won't see a button magically appear with which you can pull in just that one post or comment you want to pull in.
Rather, the issue is that they can only reel in almost everything. Sometimes the search returns nothing, like a void. Sometimes the search runs indefinitely without any kind of result. This may be because someone has blocked your channel, because someone has blocked your entire server, because the server someone is on has blocked you or your entire server, because Hubzilla/(streams)/Forte doesn't understand the URI pasted into the search field or whatever.
So this is made worse by Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte not knowing what they can search for, what they can't and why not.
Connecting with someone whom you encounter on your channel stream is fairly easy. Connections can be initiated with only two clicks. Either you click their long name, and you're taken to a pretty much distraction-less local "intermediate page" with a striking green button that's labelled "+ Connect". Or if you don't want to leave the channel page, you hover your mouse cursor over their profile picture, click on the little white arrow that appears, and you get a small menu that offers you the "Connect" option as well. Granted, even some veterans don't know the latter trick because it isn't immediately advertised on the channel page.
Also, sure, you don't simply follow them right off the bat with nothing else to do like on Mastodon. You're taken to your Connections page, and you have to configure the connection (you don't have to do that on Mastodon because you can't configure connections on Mastodon).
Following accounts/channels from the directory is a bit easier. The green "+ Connect" button is there right away (unless you're already connected). However, Hubzilla's directory only lists channels based on the Nomad protocol, i.e. Hubzilla and (streams) channels, because ActivityPub is only implemented in an optional, off-by-default-for-new-channels add-on whereas it's in the core and on by default on (streams) and the only available protocol on Forte.
Importing contents or following actors when seeing them locally on other servers without copy-pasting and searching can be done. It requires OpenWebAuth magic single sign-on, however, and it requires it to be implemented on all servers of all Fediverse server applications from Mastodon to WordPress to Ghost to Flipboard. Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte are the only Fediverse server applications with full (client-side and server-side) OpenWebAuth implementations. But that's of little use if the rest of the Fediverse doesn't have server-side implementations, and Mastodon has even silently rejected a mere client-side implementation already developed to a pull request two years ago.

The Sin of DM Disasters Waiting to Happen


I think this is less of an issue on Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte because they handle DMs differently from Mastodon (which "the Fediverse" actually refers to in the article).
On all three, DMs are integrated into their extensive, fine-grained permissions system in which everything is only public if it's really public. The difference between a post and a DM is not just a switch.
If I want to DM you, I can either tag you !benpatemastodon.social rather than url=https://mastodon.social/benpateBen Pate /url. Then you're a) the only one to whom the message is sent (it literally doesn't even go out to any other server than mastodon.social plus my clone on hub.hubzilla.de as can be seen in the delivery report) and b) the only one who is granted permission to view the message.
Or I can use the padlock icon and select you from the opening list as the sole recipient. The very moment that I select certain recipients, the post I'm composing quits being public, and the padlock icon switches from open to closed. This isn't a one-click or two-click toggle. You don't do that casually. It's basically configuration. It requires so many mouse clicks that you do it consciously and intentionally. If you want to post in private, you have to really want to post in private.
Better yet: You can default to posting only to a certain limited target audience. In fact, by default on a brand-new channel, you only post to the members of one privacy group/access list (which is a Mastodon list on coke and 'roids). You have to manually reconfigure your new channel if you want to post to the general public by default.
If you preview your post, you can see whether it's a direct message to one or multiple single connections (envelope icon next to your long name), a limited-permissions message to one or multiple privacy groups/access lists/group actors (closed padlock icon) or actually public (no icon).
Even better yet: Posts to group actors generally aren't public. Posts to at least Friendica groups, Hubzilla forums, (streams) groups and Forte groups are never public. They do not go out to your followers as well unless they're connected to the same group. And this is independent from whether a group is public or private. You can't accidentially post to a group actor in public, and if you do, you don't post to that group actor at all, at least not in a way that makes the group actor forward your post to its other connections.
Granted, what does not happen is your background switching from your background colour or background image (which can be user-configured) to red #800000 or a yellow-and-back chevron pattern when you change visibility and permissions to something that isn't public.

The Sin of Ghost Conversations and Phantom Follower Counts


And again, when says, "the Fediverse", he almost exclusively means Mastodon. He writes as if the entire Fediverse handled conversations as terribly as Mastodon, as if the entire Fediverse was as blissfully unaware of enclosed conversations as Mastodon. Which is not the case.
Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte, as well as their ancestor Friendica, handle conversations in ways that exceed Mastodon users' imaginations and wildest dreams by magnitudes. Unlike Mastodon, they know threaded conversations, and they see them as enclosed objects where only the start post counts as a post, and everything else counts as a comment.
This means that once you've received a post on your stream, you will also receive all comments on that post, regardless of whether or not you follow the commenters, regardless of whether or not they mention you. That's because all four reel in the comments not from the commentors, but from the original poster who is perceived as the owner of the thread. Only blocks or channel-wide filters can prevent comments from coming in.
Beyond that, (streams) was the first to introduce . Forte inherited them from (streams), and when they were defined in , Hubzilla implemented them, too.
Here on Hubzilla, I can see all comments in this thread because my channel has fetched them directly from . And I can actually see them right away because that's the default view here on Hubzilla, rather than Mastodon's piecemeal.
Even if you import a post manually using the search feature (and you better import the actual start post), AFAIK existing comments will eventually be backfilled. Comments that come in after importing will definitely end up on your stream as part of the thread.
So this is not a shortcoming of the Fediverse. The Fediverse has been able to do better for 15 years. It's a shortcoming of Mastodon.
The only "issue" here may be that it sometimes takes some time for a comment to show up for some reasons. But unless there are blocks or filters in play, it eventually will.

The Sin of Invisible Discovery: The Content Mirage


I'm not going to pick on the audacious implication that "Eugen and team" invented the Fediverse.
But Tim writes like literally everyone wants "the Fediverse" (read, actually Mastodon) to be literally Twitter without Musk.
Also:

Oh, and none of them has an explicit opt-in switch to soothe panicking Twitter converts because panicking Twitter converts have never been the primary target audience of either of them.
Instead, on Hubzilla, whether someone can find your content depends on whether they've got permission to view it in the first place ("Can view my channel stream and posts"). If it's public, they have it. Full stop. Public is public is public. Stop whining. You've made it public, now deal with everything being able to see it.
(streams) and Forte behave the same. In addition, they have an extra permission: "Grant search access to your channel stream and posts". This controls who may search your channel stream using your own local search feature while visiting your channel locally. Something that isn't even possible on Mastodon.
As for not having any content on my channel stream before I connect to anyone: I, for one, do not want some algorithm to force content upon me that I'm not interested in. Full. Frigging. Stop. I want to have full and exclusive control over what I see and what I don't.

The Sin of User Discovery Hell


Can it really be that Mastodon's directory is so much worse than Friendica's, Hubzilla's, (streams)' and Forte's directories I guess it is because it really only lists local accounts on that one particular server. A side-effect of Mastodon being a microblogging service and Twitter clone. And not a full-blown, fully-featured social network and Facebook alternative. No, seriously, it isn't that.
Friendica is. It was designed as such. It was designed to take Facebook's place, and not by aping and cloning Facebook, but by being better than Facebook.
The directory on each node is decentralised. It lists all actors known to that node. What's outright unimaginable from a Mastodon point of view: It takes the keywords in the profiles into account. Better even: It ranks suggestions by the number of matching keywords.
Want something centralised instead Try the . Looking for people Looking for news accounts Looking for groups There are specialised tabs for that. Friendica can tell them apart, and so can the Friendica Directory.
Caveat: The Friendica Directory only lists Friendica accounts. Friendica's built-in directory should list everything it knows. I haven't used Friendica in many years, but I guess this even includes diaspora* accounts because why not
Hubzilla has indirectly inherited its directory from Friendica.
Again, it lists local as well as federated channels. You can choose whether to see only local channels ("This Website Only") or federated channels as well. You can choose whether channels flagged NSFW shall be listed or not ("Safe Mode"). You can choose to only have group actors listed that let themselves be listed ("Public Forums Only"). You have a cloud of keywords from the keyword lists in the profiles that you can filter by (Mastodon doesn't even have keyword lists in profiles). You have full-text search for names and keywords. There's even a Facebook-style suggestion mode that proposes connections to you with a ranking based on your keywords and their keywords as well as the number of common connections, and that still has the same filters.
Caveat this time: Hubzilla's directory only supports the one sole protocol built into Hubzilla's core. And that's Zot6. This means that Hubzilla's directory only lists Hubzilla and (streams) channels because Hubzilla and (streams) are the only Fediverse server applications that support Zot6.
(streams) and Forte have inherited their directories again. And they probably have the most powerful decentralised directories in the entire Fediverse. I'd give you a link, but (streams) directories generally aren't public only local channels can access them.
These directories are similar to the ones on Hubzilla. You see local and federated actors, and you can choose to only see local actors ("This Website Only"). You can choose to only see group actors ("Groups Only"). You can choose to not see channels flagged NSFW ("Safe Mode"). What's new: Inactive actors can be kept out, too ("Recently Updated").
Now it comes: (streams) has ActivityPub built into its core, and it's on by default on new channels. Forte is entirely based on ActivityPub.
This means that their directories can list anything from anywhere that uses ActivityPub. "Groups Only" gives you Guppe groups, Lemmy communities, /kbin and Mbin magazines, PieFed communities, Mobilizon groups, Flipboard magazines, Friendica groups, Hubzilla forums, (streams) groups, Forte groups etc., all on one list.
(streams) has a slight edge over Forte here because it also lists Hubzilla and (streams) channels that have ActivityPub off such as the Streams Users Tea Garden where ActivityPub was turned off with the very intention to keep Mastodon out.
If there was a gigantic Forte server, as big as mastodon.social, and its directory was accessible to the public, that directory would be the best directory in the Fediverse for anything really. If it was on (streams), it would list more, but it would confuse some users of e.g. Mastodon who'd try to follow Hubzilla or (streams) channels that have ActivityPub off. Forte simply doesn't list these because it can't find them.
A global directory of everything sounds like a good idea, but it's next to impossible to implement.
Either the directory would go look for actors itself. In order to do that, it would have to know within a split-second not only whenever a new actor is created somewhere so it can index that actor right away, but also whenever a new server is spun up so that the admin actor can be indexed, and that server can be watched. How is it supposed to know all that
Well, or the directory, a single, monolithic, centralised website, would have to be hard-coded into all Fediverse server software. That way, each server could immediately report newly created actors to the central directory upon their creation.
For starters, this would make the whole Fediverse depend on one single centralised website under the control of, if bad comes to worse, one person.
Besides, this would be a privacy nightmare. Let's suppose I create a new (streams) channel that's supposed to be private. Its existence and all its properties would be sent to the central directory before I can set it to private and restrict its permissions. This wouldn't be so bad on Hubzilla because I'd make the channel private before I turn on PubCrawl and make the channel accessible to the directory in the first place because the directory would only understand ActivityPub.
Of course, the directory would mostly be built against Mastodon. It would not understand the permissions systems implemented on Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte, and it might happily siphon off the profiles of channels where access to the profile is restricted and make them publicly accessible. On the other hand, this is likely to mean that the directory couldn't read most of Hubzilla's, (streams)' and Forte's profile text fields anyway because Mastodon doesn't have them.
But such a centralised directory wouldn't make connecting to other users that much easier and more convenient. You'd still have to copy and paste URLs or IDs into your local search and search for them (unless you're on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) or Forte where you can connect to URLs directly). At the very least, you should be able to go to the centralised directory and follow anyone just by clicking or tapping them. That, however, would require OpenWebAuth support on both your home server and that directory.
Ideally, that directory would be firmly built into all instances of all Fediverse software from snac2 to Mastodon to Hubzilla, even replacing any existing directory to confuse people less. But that would make the Fediverse even more dependent on one central website and its owner, something which should be avoided at all cost.
Lastly, nothing can ever be built into all instances of all Fediverse software. Remember that there's software with living instances that's barely being developed such as Plume. There's even software with living instances that's been officially pronounced dead such as Calckey, Firefish or /kbin. How are Firefish servers supposed to implement such a feature if nobody maintains Firefish anymore, and even the code repository was deleted
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Hes here in DFW now But he wont be for long

Hahaha.
Tell you what: has decentralised Fediverse identities as early as 2011. He invented nomadic identity (, ) almost five years before Mastodon was made. And he first implemented it in 2012 on what would later become Hubzilla (, ). That was still almost four years before Mastodon was launched.
Oh, and by the way: Hubzilla is very much part of the Fediverse. It is very much (albeit optionally) connected to and federated with Mastodon. I am replying to you right now from a Hubzilla channel which simultaneously and identically resides on two independent servers.
Nomadic identity is reality now. It is being daily-driven right now, and it has been daily-driven since long before Solid was even announced.
Solid is nothing but Hubzilla or (streams) or Forte (both are descendants of Hubzilla by Hubzilla's creator) as ordered from wish.com. A cheap and shoddy knock-off.
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# # # # # # # # # # # # # # You would still need write permission to lemmy.world's local database. For that, a local user account on lemmy.world would be a hard requirement. Local actions saved in a Lemmy database cannot reference a user in a database on a wholly different server running under a wholly different domain.
This would require
A clone before your visit sounds more practical, but it's non-sense. It simply isn't doable. How is your Mastodon instance supposed to know before the fact which Fediverse servers you want to visit and interact with like with a local account
"Drive-by cloning" during your first visit is more doable. But cloning takes time. And I'm talking from personal experience here. I myself have cloned a number of Hubzilla and (streams) channels over the years. It always took quite a bit of time to sync all the contents from one server to the other one. And none of them were even nearly as active as your Mastodon account.
Granted, cloning from Mastodon to Lemmy would be quick because Mastodon and Lemmy have next to nothing in common. Lemmy would have no use for your toots, for your images, for your followers and followed.
But let's suppose I post a (non-federating) , I advertise it in a federating post, and it sounds interesting to you. Then you'll have to come over to hub.netzgemeinde.eu to read it because, again, the actual article doesn't federate to your Mastodon timeline. Upon visiting hub.netzgemeinde.eu, j12t.social would automatically register a local user account on hub.netzgemeinde.eu and then clone your entire Mastodon account into a Hubzilla channel. And I mean pretty much all of it. This would take considerable time.
Also, drive-by cloning would have quite a few other disadvantages.
In particular, it would bog Fediverse instances down. Anyone who visits them would have their account or channel drive-by-cloned. Every Fediverse instance would have a clone of each visitor's account or channel. With all their posts and comments and DMs and all their files on it. And these clones would be sync'd with their main instances all the time.
This would also mean the end of tiny, self-hosted single-user servers like yours. Everyone who even only goes check your Mastodon profile locally on your server (and on some Fediverse server applications, that's the only way, for there's no viewing remote profiles locally) would have their account or channel drive-by-cloned.
If your account is popular enough, you'd end up with maybe tens of thousands of local user accounts with clones of other people's Fediverse identities, with all their posts and comments and DMs, with all their images and other files. And j12t.social would be pelted with nomadic syncs of all these identities all the time.
You want to use any Fediverse server like with a local account, but with your j12t.social identity Then grant everyone else the same wish. And order a big honkin' rack server for your single-user server because it won't stay single-user for long.
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I'm going to dig into FEP-ef61 (which is what I think Forte and Mitra are supporting) to see if I can make it work on my side, too.

Yes, FEP-ef61 is one out of a whole bunch of FEPs brought forward by Mike and silverpill and an important key to nomadic identity via ActivityPub.
Once there's a stable actually nomadic Mitra release, we'll also have a first successful case of a conversion of non-nomadic, ActivityPub-only software to nomadic, i.e. something that other devs could look at to see how it can be done.
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So, is Zot the one true way to get this done

No longer as I've pointed out in my first comment.
Created (actually forked*) in August, 2024, there is , the youngest member of 's software family that started in 2010 with what is now known as Friendica. It is also the first and only member of the family that only supports ActivityPub and has done so since its very inception.
Forte is the very first Fediverse software to fully rely on ActivityPub and only ActivityPub for nomadic identity. What Hubzilla and (streams) do via two versions of the Nomad protocol, Forte does entirely via ActivityPub and only ActivityPub. All support for the Nomad protocol has been removed.
In March, 2025, Forte officially had its first stable release. It is no longer experimental. It is now daily-driver-grade software.
This means that a stable point release with a full implementation of nomadic identity via ActivityPub, including cloning, exists.
There is another implementation of nomadic identity via ActivityPub in the making: , creator and maintainer of , was the first to want to use ActivityPub for nomadic identity. This time, the idea was not to take something nomadic and convert it to "ActivityPub only". It was rather to make something non-nomadic nomadic without rebuilding it against the Nomad protocol with ActivityPub as a secondary, non-nomadic protocol.
Currently, only a development version of Mitra really supports nomadic identity via ActivityPub. Inhowfar this version is nomadic itself, i.e. whether it's actually possible to clone Mitra identities across multiple instances running that development version, I don't know. After all, this is also the first attempt at converting something non-nomadic where the account/login equals the identity in the stable version into something nomadic.
See, there are two big hurdles to take from how most of the Fediverse does it to full-blown nomadic identity. Almost everywhere in the Fediverse, your login and your account is your identity. They're fully inseparable. So in order to go fully nomadic, your identity must be uncoupled not only from the server you're on, but also from your account/login.
Hubzilla did it first back in 2012 when it was still named Red. On one account on one server, you can have as many fully independent identities ("channels") as you want. Each one of them is like a full-blown account elsewhere, only that they're all on the same account, and you can switch back and forth between them without logging out and back in. Nobody can even tell that your channels are all on the same account.
Now, nomadic identity goes much further than just moving your identity to another server. Moving is a side-effect of the actual killer feature of nomadic identity: cloning. A clone is a live, hot, near-real-time, bidirectional backup of your channel on another server, but with the exact same identity as the main instance of your channel. And you can even log into your clone and use your clone like you can use the main instance of your channel.
Let's play this through under the assumption that Mastodon is nomadic.
So you're benpatemastodon.social. In this example, Mastodon is like Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte, and it has channels just the same. benpatemastodon.social is not your account. It's a channel on your account on mastodon.social.
Now you create an account on mas.to. You need to have a channel on that account. So you clone your benpatemastodon.social channel. The identity of the clone remains benpatemastodon.social even if it's on mas.to.
Now you toot something on mastodon.social. That toot is automatically sync'd over to mas.to. But it only goes out once.
You change something in the settings on mastodon.social. Those changes are automatically sync'd over to mas.to. The clone is always kept identical to the main instance in near-real-time.
This actually works both ways: You can log into the clone, toot, follow people, change settings, whatever, and it will be sync'd to the main instance.
In fact, if mastodon.social goes offline for a while, you can use your clone on mas.to regardless of the main instance being offline. When mastodon.social comes back online, everything that has happened on your clone on mas.to during the downtime is sync'd over to your main instance on mastodon.social.
Oh, and: You can make one of your clones your new main instance which changes your identity to based on the server with the new main instance (benpatemas.to) and demotes your previous main instance (should it still be online) to a clone.
Moving a channel actually involves cloning it:

So moving using nomadic identity has two advantages over moving the "traditional" way. One, you actually take everything with you. (Only exception on Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte: Which "apps", i.e. optional extra features, are activated is not cloned.) Two, you actually move, as in you don't leave a dead account/identity behind.
*Forte is a fork of the streams repository which is a fork of a fork of three forks of a fork (of a fork) of Hubzilla which, in turn, was renamed and enhanced from a fork of a fork of Friendica.
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Das klingt so, als wenn ihr einerseits ber jede Kleinigkeit berichten werdet, die Mastodon betrifft.
Aber wenn Mike Macgirvin und silverpill die nchste groe technische Revolution im Fediverse perfekt machen und das nomadische Klonen zwischen Forte und Mitra ermglichen (ist tatschlich eins ihrer nchsten Ziele), dann werdet ihr das komplett ignorieren. Forte Mitra Kennt keiner, nutzt keiner, ist es nicht wert. Erst wenn Mastodon nomadische Identitt und Klonen ber Serverarten hinaus einfhrt (wird es nie, aber mal angenommen), werdet ihr darber berichten und es so aussehen lassen, als htte Mastodon berhaupt erst die nomadische Identitt im Fediverse eingefhrt, weil ihr nicht mal Hubzilla (das nomadische Identitt schon lnger hat, als es Mastodon berhaupt gibt) auch nur in einem Nebensatz erwhnt. Kennt ja keiner, nutzt keiner, interessiert keinen.
Das ist alles andere als ausgewogene Berichterstattung. Das ist Mastodon-Propaganda.
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, most recent project from the same family that started with Friendica 15 years ago, is the first and only stable Fediverse server application that uses ActivityPub for . Nomadic identity itself is a concept created by Mike in 2011 and first implemented by himself in 2012 in a very early version of Hubzilla which he called Red back then.
This means that you can have the exact same channel/identity (think Mastodon account, but without its own login) on multiple server instances with one account each. If one server goes down, you still have at least one clone (depending on how many clones you make).
is working on implementing this on . It's still only available in development versions, though. The difference is that Mike had already created a whole bunch of Fediverse server applications with nomadic identity since 2012 he "only" had to port nomadic identity from the Zot or Nomad protocol to ActivityPub. Silverpill, on the other hand, has to implement nomadic identity in something that was built upon ActivityPub with no nomadic identity.
Both recognise each other's nomadic identities. (For comparison: Mastodon doesn't recognise any nomadic identities. It takes the two instances of this Hubzilla channel of mine for two fully separate identities.) But that's all for now.
The next step, and that's way into the future, would be to be able to clone from Forte to Mitra or from Mitra to Forte. This would give you one identity on at least two server instances of two separate Fediverse server applications.
The obvious downside is that you won't be able to take everything with you everywhere when you clone to other server types. For example, if you clone a Forte channel to Mitra, you won't be able to take your permissions settings, your permission roles, your friend zoom settings, the contents of your cloud storage, your CalDAV calendars and your CardDAV addressbook with you over to Mitra. That's simply because Mitra doesn't have any of these features.
What you envision is another step further. And that's the adoption of nomadic identity via ActivityPub and ideally also OpenWebAuth magic single sign-on, another one of Mike's creations, by all Fediverse server applications. And I mean all of them. Including extremely minimalist stuff like snac2 or GoToSocial. Including stuff that isn't actively being worked on like Plume. Including stuff that's dead, but that still has running servers, like Calckey, Firefish or /kbin. And including Mastodon which stubbornly refuses to make itself more compatible with the "competition" in the Fediverse and adopt technologies created by anyone else in the Fediverse, even more so if that someone is Mike Macgirvin.
In other words, this won't happen. Mastodon would rather turn itself into its own federated walled garden by becoming incompatible with all other ActivityPub implementations.
What many Mastodon users who know nothing about decentralisation wish for is another step further. And that's to create one account on one server instance of one Fediverse server software, no matter which, and then to have full-blown user permissions on any instance of any Fediverse server software.
Like, create one account on mastodon.social, go to a Pixelfed instance, post pictures Instagram-style, go to a PeerTube instance, upload videos, go to a WriteFreely instance, blog away, go to a Hubzilla hub, build a webpage, all with only your mastodon.social login.
Of course, this is impossible to do. This would mean that if you create an account on one Fediverse server instance, it would have to be cloned to all 30,000+ servers in the whole Fediverse instantaneously. And if you start your own instance, it would have to trigger 30,000+ servers to clone their tens of millions of accounts and channels over to your instance.
Usually, when I explain this to people who want to use everything with one login, they tell me that they don't want to use every server in the Fediverse. No, but they want to use any server in the Fediverse. Any one of the 30,000+.
And they want to use it immediately. Like, go there, use it with full-blown local user permissions right away, no delay.
Now you may argue that their account or channel could be cloned to that server when they visit it for the first time. Drive-by cloning, so-to-speak. Still, won't happen. Cloning takes time. I myself have cloned enough Hubzilla and (streams) channels over the years to be able to estimate just how long it takes. And none of my channels has ever contained tens of thousands of posts and thousands of pictures.
Besides, drive-by cloning would inflate Fediverse instances senselessly, not to mention bog them down with extra network traffic. Whenever you visit a Fediverse server instance for whichever reason (like, you want to look at a post on Friendica or Hubzilla to see what it looks like without being botched by Mastodon), your account or channel would automagically be cloned to that server instance. Another account (and channel, if necessary) on that server instance, another deluge of posts and files flooding into the database, and that clone would have to be synced with your 600 other previous drive-by clones on the 600 Fediverse server instances you've visited before.
Extra nefarious: Some "websites" that have to do with Hubzilla or a certain aspect of Hubzilla are parts of Hubzilla channels themselves. This includes . If you visited them, you'd create a drive-by clone on the Hubzilla hub which hosts that website.
So if someone set up a single-user Hubzilla hub with their personal channel and a website channel on it, and the website is interesting enough, and 10,000 Fediverse users visit it, it'll end up bigger than the biggest current Hubzilla hub within days. It'll have 10,001 accounts, namely the owner's account with two channels and 10,000 accounts with drive-by clones, automatically created by the 10,000 external visitors.
But this will remain utopic not only because it's technologically pretty much impossible and very much not feasible at all. It also requires a mechanism for one Fediverse server to recognise logins on other Fediverse servers. You know, like OpenWebAuth. You want your Mastodon account to drive-by clone itself, Mastodon will have to implement OpenWebAuth, and I mean fully implement it.
There actually is (= Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte would recognise Mastodon logins). This isn't even about full-support that'd include login recognition on Mastodon's own side. This pull request has been there for two years. It was never merged. And it probably will never be merged.
This means that the Mastodon devs have practically rejected OpenWebAuth as a feature to implement. Won't come. Ever. Not even half of it.
And this should say everything about the chances that Mastodon will ever implement nomadic identity.
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Bumper long weekend wine guide: Best pinot noir for $30 or less

New Zealands production of pinot is exceeding the demand
# #30

Bumper long weekend wine guide: Best pinot noir for $30 or less

New Zealands production of pinot
# #30

Do you absolutely depend on being on Mastodon (as opposed of the rest of the Fediverse)
Because there is Fediverse server software (as in federated with Mastodon, as in you can follow Mastodon users from there, and Mastodon users can follow you when you're there) that offers way more than 500 characters. It may also offer other features which you may want Mastodon to have, or which are even completely unimaginable from the point of view of someone who knows the Fediverse as only Mastodon. Some examples:

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Du hiu may mn trn lng bntay#shortvideo

Du hiu may mn trn lng bn tay#shortvideo Your browser does not support HTML video. Du hiu may mn trn lng bn tay#shortvideo

DRAFT WATCH #11 With week to go, Brooklyn Nets hold five picks but for how long

Lemmy ist ja eigentlich ein Reddit-Klon, also in erster Linie darauf ausgelegt, da jemand ein Bild, einen Link oder sonstwas postet und darber dann diskutiert wird. So, wie es auf Reddit thematisch spezialisierte Subreddits gibt, gibt's auf Lemmy Communities.
Lemmy ist dabei nicht die einzige Serversoftware im Fediverse, die darauf ausgelegt ist. Es gibt auch noch

Gegenber Lemmy haben sie zwei Vorteile.
Zum einen sind sie besser darin, sich mit etwas anderem als dem "Threadiverse" (Lemmy, /kbin, Mbin, PieFed, hoffentlich bald auch Sublinks) zu verbinden. Lemmy kann eigentlich nur mit Reddit-Klonen richtig fderieren.
Zum anderen haben sie als Entwickler nicht einen knallharten Stalinisten und einen knallharten Maoisten, die beide sowjetische und chinesische Greueltaten relativieren oder gar bestreiten.
Lemmys einziger Vorteil ist, da alle bekannten Lemmy-Communities listet, aber keine /kbin- oder Mbin-Magazine und auch keine PieFed-Communities.
Kulturell ist Lemmy vllig anders als Mastodon. Es ist nicht Mastodon mit thematischen Gruppen. 99% aller "Lemminge" kommen direkt von Reddit und kennen Reddit sehr gut, aber meistens weder Twitter noch Mastodon.
Twitter-Nutzer, die nach Mastodon abgehauen sind, fanden meistens die Twitter-Kultur grausig und vergiftet. Daher haben sie auf Mastodon eine ganz neue Kultur "erfunden", die a) von Twitter inspiriert ist, b) aber freundlicher ist und c) die bis Mitte 2022 bestehende Mastodon-Kultur regelrecht verdrngt hat.
Redditors, die nach Lemmy abgehauen sind, fanden dagegen die Reddit-Kultur nicht scheie. Sie haben im Prinzip die Reddit-Kultur 1:1 nach Lemmy bertragen, wo sie sich nur ein bichen wandelte, weil Lemmy eben kein zentralisierter Monolith ist. Die Lemmy-Kultur hat mit der Mastodon-Kultur nichts, aber auch gar nichts zu tun. Statt dessen ist sie die Reddit-Kultur plus Stnkern gegen andere Lemmy-Instanzen.
Das heit in der Praxis: Wenn du nach Lemmy postest oder kommentierst und dich dabei zu sehr nicht wie ein Redditor verhltst, dann wirst du komisch angeguckt.

Von Mastodon nach Lemmy posten


Ich mchte noch einmal konkretisieren, wie man mit Mastodons beschrnkten Mitteln nach Lemmy postet. Dabei sind zwei Dinge wichtig: Zum einen ist auf Lemmy ein Titel absolut essentiell wichtig, whrend Mastodon kaum wei, was Titel sind. Zum anderen ist unbedingt die Lemmy-Community zu erwhnen.
Wenn du von Mastodon nach Lemmy posten willst, mu das so aussehen:
Titel
(Leerzeile, der bersichtlichkeit halber und evtl. auch aus technischen Grnden empfohlen)
Lemmy-Community
(Leerzeile, der bersichtlichkeit halber und evtl. auch aus technischen Grnden empfohlen)
Post-Text

Wenn du nach Lemmy, Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams), Forte und Guppe crossposten willst, dann geht das so:
Titel
(Leerzeile, der bersichtlichkeit halber und evtl. auch aus technischen Grnden empfohlen)
Lemmy-Community Friendica/Hubzilla/(streams)/Forte-Gruppe1 Friendica/Hubzilla/(streams)/Forte-Gruppe2 Friendica/Hubzilla/(streams)/Forte-Gruppe3 ... Guppe-Gruppe1 Guppe-Gruppe2 Guppe-Gruppe3
(Leerzeile, der bersichtlichkeit halber und evtl. auch aus technischen Grnden empfohlen)
Post-Text

Das heit, du erwhnst:

Auch wichtig: Alle Erwhnungen mssen in einer und derselben Zeile stehen! Du solltest sie also nicht aus irgendeinem Grunde untereinander in jeweils einer eigenen Zeile anordnen.
Auerdem wichtig: Keine Hashtags! Du kannst zwar mit Hashtags nach Lemmy posten. Aber Lemmy kennt keine Hashtags, weil Reddit keine kennt. Zum einen braucht Lemmy keine Hashtags, weil es ja die Communities gibt. Zum anderen, wenn du Hashtags postest, macht das bei den ganzen Redditors auf Lemmy keinen guten Eindruck. Auf Lemmy knnen Posts und Kommentare nmlich auch downgevotet werden (Upvote auf Lemmy = Fave auf Mastodon Downvote = das Gegenteil, das Mastodon gar nicht kennt, Lemmy aber sehr wohl), und ich wage zu behaupten, es gibt einige, die Posts mit Hashtags wegen der Hashtags downvoten.

Von Mastodon nach Lemmy kommentieren


Hier wre auch noch etwas erwhnenswert: Im Gegensatz zu Mastodon kennt Lemmy Konversationen. Und die funktionieren ohne Erwhnungen. Man braucht Lemminge nicht zu erwhnen, damit sie mitbekommen, da man in einem Thread kommentiert hat. Das ist da vllig anders als auf Mastodon.
Das heit auch: Wenn du in einem Lemmy-Thread kommentierst, lsch auf jeden Fall die von Mastodon automatisch generierte Erwhnung raus! Die fllt da genauso negativ auf wie Hashtags. Das macht man da nicht.
Beim Kommentieren sollte auch das Erwhnen der Lemmy-Community berflssig sein. Dein Kommentar kommt auch so an.
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The Suns have three paths forward, but only one leads to long-term hope

Lng bit n gip bn thu ht nhiu may mn n

Lng bit n gip bn thu ht nhiu may mn n Your browser does not support HTML video. Lng bit n gip bn thu ht nhiu may mn n


Last updated: 2025-06-21






Using video for Promotion my video.is fabulous.com