Celebrate consciously with us in this
Ich bin kein Entwickler, aber meines Wissens ist die einzige Chance, die du hast, eine Fediverse-Instanz zu erkennen, Nodeinfo. Selbst das ist nicht 100% zuverlssig, schon gar nicht, wenn du hndisch eine Liste von Fediverse-Projekten aufsetzt und die mit der Nodeinfo zugreifender Server abgleichen willst.
Es gibt nmlich auch , eine Facebook-Alternative aus derselben Familie wie auch Friendica und Hubzilla vom selben Entwickler. Es ist mit voller Absicht offiziell namenlos, es hat keine Markenidentitt, und mit derselben vollen Absicht ist Nodeinfo fast komplett entfernt worden. Damit gibt es auch keinen vereinheitlichten Identifikator wie "mastodon" oder "hubzilla". Jede Instanz kann nicht nur einen eigenen Namen haben, sondern auch einen eigenen individuellen Identifikator, wo jeder gesunde Mensch von allen Instanzen dasselbe vereinheitlichte "streams" erwarten wrde.
Zum einen mtest du also deine Liste immer nachpflegen, wenn wieder irgendjemand Misskey oder einen Misskey-Fork geforkt hat oder so. Zum anderen mtest du in deiner Liste auch den Identifikator von jeder einzelnen (streams)-Instanz eintragen, der sich brigens auch mal ndern kann.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Streams #(streams) #nodeinfo
This includes not only original renderings from 3-D virtual worlds with two image descriptions each, but also Fediverse memes. For the latter, I've actually launched . It is absolutely part of the Fediverse, it is federated with Mastodon both in theory and in practice, it can be followed from Mastodon, and therefore, it must adhere to the rules of the Fediverse as much as possible with something that isn't Mastodon.
Now, my meme posts aren't usually easy to understand, not even for Fediverse users, because I tend to dive deep into the Fediverse, far beyond Mastodon. Thus, the topics of my posts may require a lot of explanation. Also, I can't always expect everyone to a) be familiar with and b) understand the template(s) I use. So, these require a lot of explanation, too.
My experience of more than one year of improving my image descriptions is that many Fediverse users, especially Mastodon users, love having all kinds of information served to them on a silver platter without them even having to ask. And so I try to provide all information needed to understand my meme posts with next to no prior knowledge.
However, I don't do so in the alt-text. The visual description, complete with full, 100% verbatim transcripts of all texts added in the image macro, goes into the alt-text, yes. But the explanations don't.
First of all, and this is very important: Explanations do not belong into alt-text because not everyone can access alt-text. There can be many reasons why someone can't access alt-text, including a variety of physical disabilities which make it impossible for people to move and hold a mouse cursor over an image. But if they can't access alt-text, information exclusively available in the alt-text and neither in the post nor in the image is inaccessible and therefore lost to them.
In addition, my explanations are too long for alt-text. That is, they aren't too long for alt-text on (streams) which technically has no character limit. But Mastodon, Misskey and their respective forks would chop it off at the 1,500-character mark. And besides, even on (streams) itself, the maximum amount of alt-text that can be read is limited itself, depending on the user interface, because it can't be scrolled.
Finally, my explanations tend to grow too long for screen readers. Having a screen reader read out 1,500 characters of alt-text with no possibility to navigate that chunk of text, e.g. jump back to a certain sentence in the alt-text, is inconvenient. Now imagine using a screen reader to read several tens of thousands of characters.
And so I've decided to do the same with my meme explanations as I do with my long image descriptions for my original images: I put them into the post itself. I don't have any character limit there either, and nothing will truncate my extremely long posts.
This was particularly important for my first attempt at a new meme-posting format, . From what I've caught over the months, the Fediverse in general preferred having all explanations for an image in one place, the same place as the image itself, over links to external explanations. And so I tried to explain that image as in-depth as possible with as few external links as possible for as little prior knowledge as I could expect from Fediverse users.
Of course, I had to explain the image itself. But all by itself, that explanation wasn't exactly comprehensible because it would have required knowledge from two niches, namely about the template and about the topic.
And so I explained the template on a level not much lower than KnowYourMeme. But in order to make that explanation comprehensible, I also had to explain image macros, snowclones and advice animals. In order to make these comprehensible, I had to explain Something Awful, 4chan and imageboards in general in addition. The template explanations alone are over 10,000 characters long.
But would you know what FEP-ef61 is Would you know what nomadic identity is Would you know what (streams) is Probably not. Probably not even by Googling them.
And so I had to explain the topic as well. FEP-ef61. The concept of nomadic identity, what it is, what it does, how it works, what it's good for, why it was even created. The streams repository. Hubzilla. I've even rattled down the whole 14-year history from Mistpark/Friendica to the Red Matrix to Hubzilla to three different Osadas, Zap, another Mistpark and another Redmatrix to Roadhouse to the streams repository to what was the present time then, just so that people who only just recently thought the Fediverse equals Mastodon understand what (streams) is and where it comes from. Another 13,000 characters with a high information density.
Preamble included, the explanation of this one measly image that isn't even that complex clocked in at almost 25,000 characters. So I thought that couldn't possibly be what Mastodon users want. You know, the kind of people who are used to 1/50th of that in one post, not few of whom already go ballistic if you put 600 characters in one post.
So I ran on how people want meme posts to be explained. This time, I also mentioned what would be how long. Nobody really wanted such massive explanations. A few preferred externally linked explanations. Most didn't even want links, probably because they thought I'd put the links into the alt-text, because they couldn't imagine an image being described anyplace else than the alt-text.
Anyway, I still think I owe them explanations, also seeing as what I make memes about tends to be so obscure and/or recent that you really can't Google your explanation together.
So what I currently do is: As for meme templates, I link to the appropriate KnowYourMeme pages. As for the topic, if there's something I can link to, I link to it. Otherwise, if it needs to be explained, I explain it.
This can range from nothing more than mentioning the template and linking to KYM like for to several thousand characters of explanations because the topic is so obscure for or several thousand characters of explanations because I've combined seven meme template with a very complex and techy topic that involves seven Fediverse server applications (and one on the fringe) to make .
As you can see, it's tremendously difficult to make Fediverse meme posts understandable for total normies who think the Fediverse is only Mastodon and at the same time easy and convenient enough to consume for those who do not want to read thousands upon thousands of characters in a meme post.
By the way, if you think that 25,000 characters of explanation are absolutely, incredibly hypermassive: As I've said at the beginning, my original virtual world renderings get two image descriptions. A short one in the alt-text which recently always ends up at exactly 1,500 characters or only a few characters short. And a long one which may exceed (content warning for the link: eye contact, food) or, in one case, characters for one image, including visual descriptions, text transcripts and explanations, also because the explanations cannot be separated from the visual descriptions. And I've actually limited myself in the 60,000-character case.
It's only when I go to great lengths to reduce the details in images that I can make do with something like (content warning for the link: eye contact) . I need the explanations nonetheless. And I've actually decided against making certain images, much less posting them, because the scenery was too complex to sensibly describe and explain.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #Memes
Problem ist nur: Was der Vogelkfig nicht kann, kann Mastodon auch nicht. Und was Mastodon nicht kann, kann praktisch das ganze Fediverse nicht.
Und das kann der Vogelkfig nicht. Also kann Mastodon das auch nicht. Also existiert fr die allermeisten das Feature im ganzen Fediverse nicht.
Und trotzdem wird Mastodon hufiger als nicht als "soziales Netzwerk" bezeichnet.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #NichtNurMastodon #SozialesNetzwerk
Mastodon's dominance in numbers comes from only Mastodon even receiving any exposure outside the Fediverse and, in fact, even within Mastodon.
People who want to leave are only being told about Mastodon. Mostly from Mastodon users who, in turn, have yet to learn that the Fediverse is more than Mastodon itself.
Tech media like , mass media, even many bloggers talk about Mastodon, but they barely even mention the Fediverse, and they almost never mention anything else that's in the Fediverse. Except maybe if it's commercial like Flipboard, or if its self-advertisement is as ubiquitous as Pixelfed's.
Only Japanese escapees join Misskey which is the reason why Misskey is not exactly small.
Literally nobody from outside the Fediverse ever joins Pleroma. Or Akkoma. Or Firefish. Or Iceshrimp. Or Sharkey.
Not because they're bad. But because literally nobody even knows that they exist. Because nobody is being told about their existence. Because those who communicate to people outside the Fediverse mostly don't know themselves that they exist. Or if they do know, which is super rare, they don't talk about them to keep things nice and simple.
If Facebook should ever end up being so enshittified that a mass exodus kicks in in spite of all that "but muh friends are here", all the Facebook refugees will end up on Mastodon, too. Literally absolutely all of them.
Not because Mastodon is perfect for them. The Fediverse's primary Facebook alternative is Friendica and has been since 2010. It's worlds closer to Facebook than Mastodon.
But the migration wave will be driven forward by thousands upon thousands of Mastodon users, almost none of whom have ever heard of Friendica, much less that it's connected to Mastodon, the vast majority of whom is fully convinced that the Fediverse is only Mastodon, and the tiny rest of whom hates Friendica with a burning passion for having the audacity of being so different from Mastodon.
Well, part of this comes from Mastodon's refusal to be more compatible with the rest of the Fediverse and insistance in adding more and more non-standard, proprietary features which aren't compatible with the rest of the Fediverse.
In addition, Mastodon is so dominant that the vast majority of Fediverse users sees it as the one and only ActivityPub gold standard. Even if they learn about the Fediverse outside of Mastodon and stop denying its existence, they still think that Eugen Rochko has invented not only Mastodon, but also the Fediverse and ActivityPub because it couldn't possibly have been any different. So to them, everything that isn't Mastodon was made after Mastodon as an add-on bolted onto Mastodon.
From this come two misconceptions.
One, everything works just like Mastodon. If it doesn't, that's a bug that needs to be fixed. Including, for example, the way literally everything that isn't Mastodon or one of its forks handles conversations (or the fact that it handles conversations at all).
Two, everything is made to work with Mastodon. Mastodon users expect being able to follow Lemmy users. Because Lemmy is Mastodon's Reddit-style add-on, right What do you mean, you can't follow Lemmy users That's a bug that needs to be fixed, and as long as it isn't fixed, Lemmy is bad and broken. Never mind that Redditors can't follow other Redditors. It's a Mastodon add-on, and so it has to work by Mastodon's rules.
And that's only the raw technological side. On top comes the tendency of many Mastodon users to try and force Mastodon's culture and Mastodon's "Fediquette" upon the rest of the Fediverse. A culture and an "etiquette" that have both always completely ignored the whole rest of the Fediverse because they were largely coined by Mastodon users who, at that point, were blissfully unaware of Mastodon being connected to anything that isn't Mastodon.
More than 500 characters Not allowed in the Mastodon Fediverse. , Calckey user with thousands of characters at his disposal, was once commanded by a Mastodon fundamentalist to either limit all his posts to a maximum of 500 characters or get the fuck out of the Fediverse. True story.
Text formatting Disturbing, makes "toots" harder to read, but most of all, un-Mastodon-like, thus not allowed.
Replying to people who haven't mentioned you, and who aren't mutually connected to you Perfectly normal everywhere else and integral part of the culture of Fediverse projects that pre-date Mastodon by years. On Mastodon, it's reply-guying, an offence so grave and severe that it may justify moderation to step in.
Now, as a Mastodon user, you may wonder what's so bad about all this. I mean, all of us non-Mastodon users could easily adopt Mastodon's culture. And throw the culture of what we use overboard. No matter if it's years older than Mastodon itself, not to mention Mastodon's current culture. No matter if it's better geared towards what we use. Oh, and, of course, stop using 80-95% of the features of whatever we use.
Well, what'd you say if more and more Bluesky users demanded Mastodon users keep all their posts at 300 characters or below Or what'd you say if Threads federated fully, and then Threads users started trying to push Threads' culture upon Mastodon on the ground of Threads users being the majority now
I guess you'd defederate. While protesting loudly.
Well, then don't complain about users of Friendica (over five years older than Mastodon and federated with Mastodon for as long as Mastodon has been around) who are angry about obnoxious Mastodon users who try to force them to use Friendica like Mastodon.
And don't complain about Hubzilla or (streams) users loudly announcing that they turn ActivityPub off on their channels with the explicit intent of keeping Mastodon's toxic and ignorant supremacy out. (By the way, I know one (streams) discussion group that actually does have ActivityPub off for this very reason.)
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverseHubzilla can give Fediverse content more reach. The same applies to (streams), it will apply to Forte, and I guess it applies to Friendica as well.
You just need a whole bunch of connections, and you need to come across Fediverse content in irregular ways, e.g. by receiving posts with links to other posts or subscribing to a hashtag RSS feed on mastodon.social (the latter doesn't work on (streams) and Forte).
If you discover a post that needs more feedback (or any feedback in the first place), especially from the kind of people whom you're connected to, just copy its URL and then search for it. This way, you manually import it onto your stream.
Once you see it, repeat it.
If you've got enough reach yourself, you can now watch that post be repeated/boosted/renoted/reposted and ideally also commented on.
It's with this trick that I've actually helped join Friendica.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Boost #Boosts #FediTips Gerade mit Facebook wird das nicht klappen.
Friendica kann ja bis heute Konten einbinden von Bluesky, Tumblr und letzteres natrlich nur, wenn der Node-Admin Millionr ist und sich die API-Lizenz leisten kann, aber das Feature ist vollumfnglich da. Friendica kann sich auch mit allem mglichen anderen Kram verbinden.
2012 konnte Friendica sich auf dieselbe Art und Weise tatschlich sogar mit Facebook verbinden. Wenn die entsprechende Erweiterung auf einem Node aktiviert war (wofr der Node-Admin auf Facebook als Entwickler registriert sein mute), konnte man sein Facebook-Konto in Friendica einbinden. Der Facebook-Feed wurde Teil dessen auf Friendica. Die Facebook-Freunde wurden Friendica-Kontakte. Man konnte Facebook nutzen, ohne Facebook zu nutzen. Man konnte gleichzeitig innerhalb von Friendica und nach StatusNet, diaspora*, Twitter, Tumblr und Facebook posten und dann Antworten von berall da bekommen.
Die Idee dahinter war zweifach. Zum einen war Facebook eh noch ein fehlender Baustein in Friendicas "Wir fderieren mit allem, was nicht bei drei auf den Bumen ist"-Prinzip.
Zum anderen war die Idee, da eine Verbindung zwischen Friendica und Facebook es Facebook-Nutzern leichter machen sollte, zu Friendica zu wechseln. Erst sollten sie auf Friendica ihr Facebook-Konto einbinden. Dann sollten ihre Freunde auch so nach und nach nach Friendica kommen. Und wenn dann irgendwann ihre Freunde alle auf Friendica sind, sollten sie selbst die Facebook-Einbindung abschalten und ihr Facebook-Konto lschen knnen, weil sie es dann nicht mehr brauchen wrden.
Dieses Vorgehen hat Facebook aber gemerkt. Und das pate ihnen nicht. Also haben sie Gegenmanahmen ergriffen.
Nach einiger Zeit haben sie ihre Regeln fr Dritt-Apps gendert, und Friendica zhlte als solche. Dritt-Apps durften weiterhin Inhalte nach Facebook senden, aber keine Inhalte mehr extrahieren. Zuwiderhandlungen fhrten zum sofortigen und unwiderruflichen Verlust des Entwicklerstatus.
Einige Node-Admins haben das Facebook-Add-on bald wieder abgeschaltet, zumal das eh horrende viele Serverressourcen fra. Friendica-Nodes mit aktivem Facebook-Add-on haben meistens schon bei zwischen 130 und 140 Nutzern die Registrierung geschlossen, weil sie voll waren.
Andere haben es laufen lassen, gerade auch, weil ihre Nutzer es eifrig in Benutzung hatten. Sie haben einfach riskiert, da Facebook sie erwischt und ihnen den Hahn abdreht. Dann wre es eh egal gewesen, dann htten sie den Entwicklerstatus eh nicht mehr gebraucht. Bis dahin sollte der noch in Benutzung bleiben.
Von den Friendica-Entwicklern kam dann ein alternatives Facebook-Add-on, das nur noch in eine Richtung als reiner Crossposter funktionierte. Das ist praktisch berhaupt nicht angenommen worden, weil es letztlich ziemlich sinnfrei war. Im Grunde schien es nur zu existieren, damit Friendica von sich behaupten konnte, sich weiterhin mit Facebook verbinden zu knnen.
Sptestens 2014 drften beide Add-ons wieder komplett verschwunden gewesen sein. Und bis heute drfte Facebook seine Regeln fr Drittanwendungen nicht wieder so gelockert haben, da Friendica die volle Fderation wieder wagen knnte.
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Ich wrde ja sagen: "Bald sind sie es", weil dieses Verhalten so manch einem Fediverse-aber-nicht-Mastodon-Nutzer auf den Geist geht. Aber ich glaube, die bleiben bei der Stange, auch um diese Falschbehauptungen bei jeder Gelegenheit widerlegen zu knnen.
Und zu noch mehr Leuten, die "wissen", da das Fediverse nur Mastodon ist, weil ihnen das entweder suggeriert oder direktweg so gesagt wurde.
Und zu noch mehr Entwicklern, die Sachen fr "das Fediverse" entwickeln, die dann so hart nur gegen Mastodon hartgecodet sind, da sie schon mit Akkoma oder Firefish nicht mehr funktionieren.
Und zu noch mehr Leuten, die sich so ans Mastodon-Fediverse gewhnt haben, da sie sich mit Zhnen, Klauen und Blocks gegen alle Hinweise wehren, da das Fediverse eben nicht nur Mastodon ist. Und davon gibt es nun wirklich jetzt schon nicht wenige.
Und zu noch mehr Fundamentalisten, die im ganzen Fediverse eine Kultur und eine Etikette zwangsweise durchzusetzen versuchen, die nur auf Mastodon und seinen Features aufbaut. Die Nutzern z. B. des ber fnf Jahre lteren Friendica, das berhaupt nicht wie Mastodon ist und um Grenordnungen mchtiger, vorzuschreiben versuchen, Friendica genau wie Mastodon zu benutzen, locker 80% von Friendicas Features nicht mehr zu verwenden, Friendicas sehr viel ltere Kultur ber Bord zu werfen und sich ausschlielich an Mastodons Kultur zu halten.
Das sind keine Hirngespinste. Ich knnte hier Leute erwhnen, insbesondere auf Friendica, die schon hart mit "Fediverse = Mastodon"-Leuten aneinandergeraten sind.
Das ist leider generell auf Mastodon so. Mastodon stellt 70% der User, aber gefhlt ber 95% des Traffic auf Mastodon kommen von Mastodon. Es gibt Mastodon-Nutzer, die folgen hunderten Mastodon-Nutzern und keinem einzigen Nicht-Mastodon-Nutzer. Man kann zwei Jahre auf Mastodon verbringen, hunderten Leuten folgen und keinen einzigen Beitrag je zu Gesicht bekommen, der nicht von Mastodon kommt.
Beispielsweise ber Features, die Mastodon-Nutzer gerne im "Fediverse" htten, die aber im Fediverse auerhalb von Mastodon schon seit Jahren verfgbar sind.
Oder ber Features, die Mastodon-Nutzer auf gar keinen Fall im "Fediverse" haben wollen, die das Fediverse aber auerhalb von Mastodon lngst hat. Z. B. Volltextsuche oder Drkos/Drukos.
Oder ber Verhaltensweisen, die auf Friendica schon einige Jahre lnger gang und gbe sind, als es Mastodon berhaupt gibt, die aber in Mastodons das gesamte brige Fediverse als nichtexistent ansehender Kultur ein schwerwiegendes und unbedingt zu sanktionierendes Fehlverhalten sind. Z. B. Antworten auf Beitrgen von Leuten, die einen weder erwhnt haben noch mit einem gegenseitig verbunden sind.
Dieses Wundern kommt ja gerade daher, da jeder, der neu ins Fediverse kommt, lernt, da "Fediverse" und "Mastodon" gegenseitig vlllig gleichbedeutend sind, und sich dann ber Monate genau daran gewhnt.
Entsprechend abrupt reagieren viele, wenn sie mit der Wahrheit konfrontiert werden. Ob es ihnen einfach jemand ungefragt sagt (fragen wrden sie ja eh nicht) oder sie auf einen Beitrag in ihrer Timeline stoen, der so auf gar keinen Fall von Mastodon kommen kann (ber 500 Zeichen, Textformatierung, Punktliste, Zitat, Drko/Druko o. .), ist egal.
Und so steigt leider nicht nur die Zahl derjenigen kontinuierlich an, die "wissen", da das Fediverse nur Mastodon ist, und das berhaupt nicht in Frage stellen, sondern auch die Zahl derjenigen, die sich regelrecht gegen Informationen ber die Existenz eines Fediverse auerhalb von Mastodon zur Wehr setzen.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NichtNurMastodon It's sad that it's always Bluesky, Threads and Mastodon. The Fediverse is only represented by Mastodon, only Mastodon and nothing but Mastodon, as if there's nothing else. Always.
The Fediverse's quality in microblogging is always measured in what vanilla Mastodon can and can't do. If Mastodon lacks something, the Fediverse lacks it.
But the Fediverse is not only Mastodon. Not even in terms of microblogging.
Pleroma is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Akkoma is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Misskey is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Firefish is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Iceshrimp is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Sharkey is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Catodon is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Mitra is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
And that's only a selection.
None of them are related to Mastodon. None of them have even a grain of Mastodon in them. They're fully independent developments.
Feature-wise, they all blow Bluesky and Threads and Mastodon out of the water. In fact, if you want "the Fediverse", read, Mastodon to have a certain feature, Misskey probably has it right now. If Misskey doesn't, Iceshrimp or Sharkey may have it. And that doesn't say anything about the more Facebook-like and even more powerful parts of the Fediverse yet.
If Mastodon wants to evolve, it will first have to catch up to the rest of the Fediverse.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Sharkey #Catodon #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverse Schwierig.
Friendica ist ja das einzige, was keine Brcke braucht. Aber auch Friendica ist kein Bluesky-PDS und schon gar kein kompletter PDS/Relay/AppView-Stack. Da mu man immer noch ein Bluesky-Konto einbinden.
Wenn man das im Diagramm bercksichtigen will, dann brauchen auch , Tumblr und Libertree eigene Kreise mit eigenen Farben. Ja, . Wenn du als Node-Admin die Millionen hast fr einen vollwertigen API-Key, kannst du deinen Friendica-Node voll mit verbinden, und die Nutzer auf deinem Node knnen ihre -Konten da einbinden. Das ist zwar schweineteuer, funktioniert aber noch, also kein Grund, das rauszuwerfen.
Und es bruchte eigene Kreise mit eigener Farbe fr die WordPress XMLRPC API, denn von Friendica und Hubzilla aus kann man zu WordPress-Blogs crossposten und brigens auch von WordPress nach Friendica.
Im Grunde wren da Kreise fr GNU social und XMPP (was ja selbst eigentlich nur ein Protokoll ist) sogar noch angebrachter, ebenso fr RSS/Atom, denn Friendica und Hubzilla knnen auch RSS- und Atom-Feeds abonnieren. Bei letzterem bruchte es dann aber Richtungspfeile.
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On the one hand, that's what the (streams) predecessor Roadhouse already did from when it was launched in early 2021 on. (streams) and Forte do the same.
On the other hand, the more widespread definition of "community" is the Lemmy equivalent of a subreddit. So if you want Lemmy to refer to its instances as "communities", it first needs to find a new name for its discussion groups.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Roadhouse #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Lemmy #Communities
They're all free and open-source.
was originally under the MIT license and was relicensed by the community under the GNU Affero GPL v3 in 2012.
is under the MIT license.
(streams) is under the MIT license.
Forte is under the MIT license, too.
All of them are also as decentralised as Mastodon. That is, Forte still isn't officially ready for prime time it's only used by its developer so far.
Also, (streams) never really took off because it's too uninteresting for the Hubzilla crowd, and hardly anyone else even knows about it. And the already small number of public instances shrunk further this summer. So it's basically currently down to only one recommendable public instance with open registration, and even there you'll have to give a reason why you want to join.
By giving cool n00bs who connect to you permission to comment on your posts.
That said, limiting comment permission is a last resort because it means that the general public can't reply to your posts anymore, only a select few of your contacts. This means you'll inevitably end up in a very small bubble.
Unfortunately, you can't deny permissions to specific users which are granted to the general public. Also, granting permissions requires a connection.
So if you don't want to "punish" the general public for what a few people do, if you do want the general public to reply to you, the only way to get rid of specific reply guys is to block them. This is also the only way to get rid of people reply-guying your comments on other people's posts.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte If you want to max out user safety in the Fediverse, do not place all your bets on Mastodon!
Again: The Fediverse is not only Mastodon. The Fediverse isn't Mastodon with stuff bolted onto Mastodon either.
There's a whole lot of stuff in the Fediverse that's developed fully independently from Mastodon. There's stuff that's older than Mastodon. There's stuff that's a whole lot different from Mastodon. And "different" doesn't mean "wrong". Mastodon is not the Fediverse's quality standard. No, really, it isn't.
One issue that you've mentioned are reply guys. What you seem to be looking for is a technological barrier that's absolute, 100% water-tight safety from reply-guying.
This means that you'll have to go with Mastodon's re-definition of a reply guy: anyone who replies to you without being mutually connected to you, and without having been mentioned by you in the post which that person replies to. Because by Mastodon's standards, it shouldn't even be possible for such a post to show up on your timeline.
But, again, the Fediverse is not only Mastodon. Nor does the Fediverse in its entirety work like Mastodon. Especially in this regard. Not everything in the Fediverse tries to mimic Twitter.
For example, Friendica. Friendica is a Facebook alternative that was launched in 2010. And when Mastodon was launched, it immediately federated itself with a Friendica which, at that point, was five and a half years old and had its own living, breathing culture based on its own technology. Which is vastly different from Mastodon.
Friendica doesn't think in single posts loosely tied together. Friendica thinks in full conversations. Whereas Mastodon doesn't even know what a conversation is.
And: On Friendica, if you receive a post, you receive the whole thread. With all comments.
Let's suppose you follow Alice. Alice sends a post. Bob comments on the post. Carol comments on the post. But Bob and Carol don't mention you, and you don't follow them.
On Mastodon, you only see Alice's post.
On Friendica, you see Alice's post, Bob's comment and Carol's comment. With no following, with no mentions. Because you've received Alice's post, you also receive all comments.
This is not a bug. This is absolutely intentional. For this is how Facebook works which Friendica aims to replace. It has always been this way. And it's deeply engrained in Friendica's culture.
This also means that anyone on Friendica can and does comment on comments by people who haven't mentioned them and whom they don't follow, just because these people have commented on something someone wrote whom these Friendica users follow.
Oh, and by the way: Hubzilla, a fork of Friendica by Friendica's creator from 2015, works the same. (streams), a fork of a fork of three forks of a fork (of a fork) of Hubzilla by Friendica's and Hubzilla's creator from 2021, works the same. Forte, a fork of (streams) by still the same creator from this year, works the same.
They're all part of the Fediverse, and they're all federated with Mastodon. I'm writing to you from Hubzilla right now.
In fact, Pleroma and its various forks, particularly Akkoma, knows conversations, too. Misskey and its many forks, including but not limited to Calckey/Firefish, Sharkey, CherryPick, Iceshrimp, Catodon, Neko, Meisskey, Tanukey etc., all know conversations. Again, they're all part of the Fediverse, and they're all federated with Mastodon.
So first of all, we have a difference in culture based on a difference in technology and use-case.
Of course, the natural reaction of many Mastodon users would be to put the proverbial gun against the chests of everything that isn't Mastodon and try to force it to become another Mastodon and ditch up to 90% of its features because Mastodon doesn't have them, and to force everyone who isn't on Mastodon to use whatever they have exactly like Mastodon. Believe me, I know people to whom this has actually happened. I could mention them.
You can try. But you can't expect it to work. No, seriously, you can't.
As for a technological barrier: If you want it installed on Mastodon, it won't work. Not with a Fediverse that isn't entirely Mastodon.
It might work with a proper permissions system like on Hubzilla or (streams) or Forte, and even that only if it was made into an FEP, a quasi-standard, and all the Fediverse adopted this system in fully compatible ways. And even that would only give you the power to define
This, however, means:
Speaking of permissions: If you want safety, ditch that underwhelming, intentionally lack-lustre and hopelessly outdated kluge that's Mastodon and look elsewhere in the Fediverse where the real innovations are made.
Imagine you, as a user, could generally define
Also, Mastodon only has everybody and nobody as options. Now imagine you can generally grant any permission to
Yes, "whom you explicitly grant that permission". Imagine you can grant permissions individually to certain contacts and not to other contacts.
Imagine you can be mutually connected with Alice, but still keep Alice from sending you her toots. Imagine you can disallow Alice and Bob, both mutual connections of yours, to see your profile, but you can allow Carol to see it.
Science-fiction No.
This has been reality on Hubzilla since 2012, for a dozen years, almost four years longer than Mastodon has been around. Permissions are everything on Hubzilla.
This is not experimental. This is rock-solid technology, daily-driven by thousands of Fediverse users. This is technology available in the Fediverse right now.
(streams) and Forte have a similar, compatible permissions system, only that the controls are different, and a few permissions are different. They have an additional permission setting for searching your posts, and they even let you allow or disallow individual contacts to send you boosts. Also, the only general, channel-wide permissions levels they have are
That said, these permissions have their limitations outside the Hubzilla/(streams)/Forte ecosystem. They can keep certain unwanted things out, but they can't keep them from happening.
For example, let's suppose you're on (streams), and you only let certain people comment on your posts. If someone is on Hubzilla or (streams) and receives one of your posts, and that someone isn't permitted to comment on it, certain UI elements for replying are removed for them, and so they can't reply.
But neither Hubzilla nor (streams) nor Forte can make UI elements disappear on Mastodon or on Misskey or on Iceshrimp or on Akkoma or elsewhere. In other words, a Mastodon user can still reply to you. You'll never receive that reply. If you're the only recipient of that reply on your instance, the whole instance rejects the reply. But still, that reply is made and sent. At the very least, it ends up on the replier's timeline and the local timeline of their Mastodon instance.
There's only one way for the Fediverse to become significantly safer: This kind of permissions system must be turned into an FEP, and it must remain fully compatible with the existing implementations. And the whole Fediverse, vanilla Mastodon included, must implement it to its full extent.
Yes, this makes the Fediverse harder to use.
But seriously, you can't expect your real-life home to be safer than Fort Knox while you're still able to walk in and out anytime without even having to open one single door.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta
It's also a very early, very, very unfinished and very, very, very incomplete draft. I should know, I should be working on it, and I have already put a lot of work into the layout and especially the Hubzilla data. Expect not only more software and more data, but even more tables, and expect some of the existing tables to change. Not to mention that I'll have to find a way to make these tables fit into the layout without losing information.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Wiki
Mastodon has the option to use filters to not only remove posts, but also to hide them behind a button like a content warning. This feature has been available for two years now.
Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte have a separate, optional feature called "NSFW" that uses its own keyword list to hide certain content behind a button. It has been their preferred way of issuing content warnings since Friendica's inception in 2010, even though Mastodon's repurposing of StatusNet's summary field (which is still a summary on all four) as a CW field since 2017 is dominant nowadays.
But of course, they all need something in the post to trigger it. It doesn't have to be a hashtag, but a hashtag is safe because it's easy to add to a post without having to bend the wording of the actual post so that it contains the right keywords to trigger the right filters.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Filters #FediTips #Hashtag #Hashtags The hashtag would be
#EyeContact
And, in addition to the one above, if you really want to drive the point home that the hashtag is there with a content-warning function to a) trigger post-removing/post-rejecting filters, b) trigger post-hiding filters on Mastodon and c) trigger the "NSFW" post-hiding feature on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte:
#CWEyeContact
I don't think there's any consensus on whether #CW and #ContentWarning should be used as actual content warning hashtags or for content warning discussions, which should be tagged #CWs, #ContentWarnings, #CWMeta and/or #ContentWarningMeta, or for both. I mean, apart from #CW being constantly used for either "continuous wave" in amateur radiotelegraphy or the CW Television network.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Filters #FediTips #Hashtag #Hashtags
Especially since the Fediverse is not only Mastodon, and not everything in the Fediverse works the same.
If Mastodon-style content warnings become mandatory to the point of instance blocks as punishment, you may go about and Fediblock the entirety of with all its instances because it currently has no working means of adding Mastodon-style content warnings to replies.
I myself have to make do with hashtags and hoping that people know how to use filters. Over here on Hubzilla, we do content warnings reader-side with filters, too, after all.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hubzilla #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta
Well, for one, Friendica and its descendants have never gone viral. It doesn't help that everything in the family prior to (streams) was made under the assumption of "if you build it, they will come". And especially Friendica was made in an era when phone apps were gimmicks rather than absolute necessities.
Hubzilla lived on Friendica converts most of the time because Friendica was just about the only place where Hubzilla was known at all. I guess most people who jumped ships from Friendica to Hubzilla did it for even more features they might need. This is also why nothing post-Hubzilla really took off: It was mostly known on Hubzilla, but just about all that Hubzilla users knew about it was that it had fewer features than Hubzilla. And people either didn't know or didn't care what was improved in comparison with Hubzilla.
Besides, nobody on Facebook expects there to be a free, decentralised Facebook alternative. And if they don't expect it, they don't Google for it, and they don't stumble upon it. If someone invites them to Mastodon, it's usually either a huge surprise that a free, decentralised alternative to anything exists, or they don't notice that Mastodon is free and/or decentralised.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Friendica #Hubzilla
In order to understand it, you have to go back to Mastodon's origins in 2016.
Mastodon was brand-new. It was somehow discovered by German press that a German lad almost fresh out of school had developed a "Twitter killer". Searing hot story in Germany which quickly spread beyond Germany.
There was also Pleroma, also from Germany, but Pleroma got nothing because it had made the mistake to position itself as an alternative Web UI for GNU social rather than direct stand-alone competition against Twitter.
There was also diaspora*, a Facebook alternative, but it was nothing but a distant memory of a crowdfunding campaign in summer 2010, in the wake of the Cambridge Analytica story, which raised $320,000 when $12,000 were the goal. But diaspora* itself wasn't released with a bang. Some six years later, it was still a public alpha, it was fairly lack-lustre, and the entire development team had to be replaced on the way. Most people had entirely forgotten about it, even tech journalists.
There were also GNU social (formerly StatusNet), Friendica and Hubzilla, but like Pleroma, the general public had never heard of them.
And so it seemed like this boy from Jena had made something that had never been done before, also because he had a ready-to-run software product and not a plan and a crowdfunding campaign.
Fast-forward to 2017. Certain fringe groups were chased off of Twitter: furries, otaku, LGBTQIA+. The only halfway Twitter-like place that at least some of them had heard of was Mastodon. So that was where they invited each other. Within no time,
It was especially then that Mastodon grew faster than anything else in the Fediverse.
Fast-forward to early 2022. Elon Musk had announced that he might buy Twitter. The first big Twitter migration wave was kicked off. And everyone who fled from Twitter into the Fediverse landed on Mastodon. Why Here are some reasons.
And so the Fediverse ended up with millions upon millions of people who initially thought that Mastodon, or even the Fediverse itself, was only mastodon.social. Or mstdn.social or mas.to if their inviters were too lazy to type on their phone screens. But most of the time, it was mastodon.social.
A typical Fediverse invite tweet looked like this back then:
No link to joinmastodon.org. No mention of instances, much less other instances. And no mention of the rest of the Fediverse.
Well, and now that Mastodon makes for 70% of the Fediverse, and at least every other Mastodon user still doesn't know about the existence of a Fediverse outside of Mastodon, there are still more people trying to invite users to Mastodon than people trying to invite users to anything else in the Fediverse combined.
Tech media and mass media don't help either. Mastodon had a huge boom, but everything else in the Fediverse didn't. Thus, Mastodon was noticed by tech media and mass media, and everything else in the Fediverse wasn't. Thus, tech media and mass media only wrote about Mastodon, but hardly about the Fediverse itself and never at all about Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Calckey/Firefish, Sharkey, Iceshrimp etc. because they never even noticed that any of these exist. Thus, the general public read about Mastodon, but hardly about the Fediverse and not at all about anything else in the Fediverse. Thus, people only know Mastodon.
And now you have next to nobody on Pleroma trying to invite people from to Pleroma.
You have next to nobody on Akkoma trying to invite people from to Akkoma.
You have next to nobody on Iceshrimp trying to invite people from to Iceshrimp.
You have next to nobody on Sharkey trying to invite people from to Sharkey.
But you have loads of people on Mastodon trying to invite people from to Mastodon.
You have loads of people on Mastodon trying to invite people from Facebook to Mastodon because they've never even heard about the existence of Friendica, much less Hubzilla, (streams) or Socialhome.
You have loads of people on Mastodon trying to invite people from all kinds of commercial silos to Mastodon because Mastodon is all they've ever heard of, and besides, they try to race Bluesky in terms of user numbers.
When it comes to microblogging, we now have:
In short: Mastodon is only so popular because nobody knows anything else. Its only advantage over the rest of the Fediverse is that many more people know it.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon Especially because they make it look like the Fediverse is a) Mastodon and b) all kinds of other stuff that actually doesn't really matter. As you've said, most of the time, they post about Mastodon and only Mastodon as if there's nothing else out there. Lumping everything that isn't Mastodon together, keeping it separate from Mastodon and only marginally touching it, if at all, makes it seem like the non-Mastodon Fediverse isn't worth bothering.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon
If one searches.
If one wants to search.
If one suspects there to be something else out there in the Fediverse.
But for many Mastodon users, the Fediverse is Mastodon and only Mastodon, and that's an absolutely undeniable fact. Set in stone. It couldn't possibly be any different. They don't even take into consideration that it could be any different. "Fediverse" is the name of the Mastodon network which is nothing but Mastodon and more Mastodon. Full stop.
Why else do so many Mastodon users use "Fediverse" and "Mastodon" mutually exchangeably or even out-right claim that the Fediverse is only Mastodon with such utter confidence
Why else does the revelation that something that isn't Mastodon is connected to Mastodon and claims its place in the Fediverse leave so many Mastodon users deranged enough to generously dish out mutes and blocks in an attempt to make the Fediverse only Mastodon again, or at least make it feel like it's still only Mastodon
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverse
It isn't like everything that isn't Mastodon speaks with one tongue anyway.
A Friendica instance is called a node. A Hubzilla instance is called a hub. A Funkwhale instance is called a pod, and so is a diaspora* instance.
Mastodon has posts officially, but toots unofficially. Misskey and the Forkeys have notes.
Mastodon boosts. Misskey and the Forkeys renote. Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte repeat.
Mastodon may have quote-posts in the future, unofficially quote-toots. Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte share instead.
Not to mention the various definitions of channels, communities etc.
Also, interestingly, in terms of UX, Misskey is actually closer to than Mastodon.
Also, when you start adding non-standard, proprietary Mastodon stuff to your non-Mastodon project, you make your project dependent on Mastodon, and you allow Mastodon to at least partially assume control over your project.
EEE in the Fediverse is way past the second E now.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse No, it's rather because people don't know what's in the Fediverse and what isn't.
I mean, at least every other Mastodon user thinks the Fediverse equals Mastodon and only Mastodon.
Let's assume I mention my own Hubzilla channel somewhere in some context. I'll hit two obstacles. One, three out of four Fediverse users have never heard of Hubzilla, so how shall they assume that it's a Fediverse project if I don't explicitly tell them so Two, again, many think the Fediverse is only Mastodon, so how shall they assume that Hubzilla is in the Fediverse when it's completely unimaginable to them that there could be anything else in the Fediverse that isn't Mastodon
Also, especially on Mastodon, nobody can tell where my post is from. Next to nobody looks up any posts at their sources anyway. Mastodon doesn't show where a post came from, software-wise. And net everyone can tell from certain signs (what mentions look like, what hashtags look like) that something came from something that's very much not Mastodon. Only the very few who can be bothered to look at my post at its source will notice that it came from something that has "Hubzilla" written on top. For the majority, everything in their Mastodon timeline came from Mastodon.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #NotOnlyMastodonIf you write about something that's in the Fediverse but not Mastodon, most Fediverse users won't know that it's in the Fediverse.
Even if you write about e.g. your Hubzilla channel or your WriteFreely blog, hardly anyone will know that they can follow you there. Yes, even when you write about your Hubzilla channel from your Hubzilla channel. Especially Mastodon users won't know what Hubzilla is, they won't know that they can follow Hubzilla channels from Mastodon, and they'll assume that you've just posted from Mastodon.
So if you want people to know that whatever you're writing about is part of the Fediverse and connected to Mastodon, you have to explicitly mention both.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse They're available all over the Fediverse outside of Mastodon.
Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Calckey, Firefish, Iceshrimp, Iceshrimp.NET, Sharkey, Catodon, Neko, CherryPick, Meisskey, Tanukey, Mitra, Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams), Forte and others, they all have quote-posts readily available now. They're all in the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon. And yes, they can quote-post Mastodon toots right now.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoost #QuotedShares Hubzilla does federate with Mastodon. In case you haven't noticed, but I'm writing to you from Hubzilla. It just requires ActivityPub to be activated both on a hub level (it is by default) and on a channel level (it is not by default). So what I meant was that Hubzilla does not have the Mastodon client API implemented, and so you can't use Hubzilla with a Mastodon phone app.
But seriously, for one, Hubzilla is structurally so far away from Mastodon that this couldn't work anyway, I guess. I don't think the Mastodon client API could be bent in such a way that it works with an architecture that has multiple channels, multiple identities on the same login, not to mention that the Mastodon client API probably couldn't handle nomadic identity with its side-effects. Even if the Mastodon client API could, Mastodon apps couldn't because almost all of them are geared towards Mastodon and only Mastodon.
Which leads me to the second point: Even if you could connect Hubzilla to a Mastodon phone app, you couldn't even use 5% of Hubzilla's features because almost all Mastodon phone apps only cover Mastodon's features, and I guess that some of those apps which already existed in 2022 still only cover Mastodon 3's features.
This is far from "better than nothing". Apart from people who have only just switched from Mastodon to Hubzilla still with Twitter on the brain, nobody on Hubzilla would refer to such massive limitations as "better than nothing". Besides, not being able to use an app is not "nothing". Hubzilla is one of the few Fediverse server applications that can be installed as a Progressive Web App. And if that doesn't work, you can use it in a browser. In other words, there's always the Web UI.
Just about all Hubzilla veterans would vastly prefer the Web UI over not being able to use text formatting (not possible on Mastodon), not being able to embed images in a post (not possible on Mastodon), not being able to add alt-text to images (works vastly different on Mastodon), not being able to add titles to posts (not possible on Mastodon) and not even being able to select a channel on their account that isn't the default (Mastodon doesn't have channels either). And that's only the tip of the iceberg.
One of the reasons why there isn't a Hubzilla phone app with a fully native mobile UI is because this UI would have to be absolutely massive. The app would end up more complex than FairEmail. A good app should offer all the same features as the Web UI. But Hubzilla itself is fully geared towards the desktop, feature-wise, handling-wise and in its philosophy. Don't forget that Hubzilla was not made as a Twitter replacement.
Lastly, neither Mario Vavti nor Harald Eilertsen is willing to add more proprietary, non-standard, Mastodon-exclusive technology to Hubzilla than absolutely necessary, if at all. And a client API that's made for something completely and utterly different from Hubzilla and that won't even work properly with Hubzilla is far from "absolutely necessary". Hubzilla rather indulges in independence from Mastodon.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #MastodonAPI #MastodonApps #Hubzilla Zumal in mehrererlei Hinsicht das Fediverse hufig mit Mastodon gleichgesetzt wird.
Es ist ja weit berwiegend auf Mastodon, wo zum einen versucht wird, die Grenzen des Fediverse mglichst eng abzustecken und alles, was nicht als Fediverse angesehen wird, auszuschlieen. Auf Friendica, dessen Bestreben ja die Fderation mit allem Mglichen und Unmglichen ist, gibt's das schon kulturell so gar nicht. Aber wenn man das Fediverse als praktisch nur Mastodon ansieht, bemerkt man das nicht.
Und zum anderen ziehen viele auf Mastodon die Grenze des Fediverse genau um Mastodon herum. Entweder wissen sie gar nicht, was das Fediverse sonst so zu bieten hat. Oder, eher seltener, sie haben schon davon gehrt oder es sogar selbst mitbekommen, wollen aber so Sachen wie Friendica, Pleroma, Misskey usw. nicht im Fediverse haben, weil die zu sehr nicht Mastodon sind.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NichtNurMastodon
Der Vogelkfig ist voll mit Selbstdarstellern, denen es nur darauf ankommt, ihre geistigen Ergsse (plus jede Menge Geklautes) an mglichst viele Leute rauszuposaunen, um sich dann was einbilden zu knnen auf ihre Followerzahlen und ihre Reichweite. An Interaktion sind sie eh nicht interessiert, nur an Fame.
Weil sie hier nicht binnen Stunden hunderttausende Follower bekommen knnen, bleiben sie hier von Natur aus weg.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Twitter # #Fediverse
Das ist doch stndig so. Jemand kommt neu in eine schon lngst etablierte Community oder Szene und versteht die nicht, schiebt das aber darauf, da alles ja so kompliziert ist. Das mu eher so und so und so sein, das findet der Neuling sehr viel einfacher.
Falls dem jetzt jemand beipflichten will und sagt, wieso, das ist doch gut: Wenn alles nach dem Gusto dieses Neulings umgebaut wird, kommt kurze Zeit spter der nchste Neuling, der das nicht versteht und wiederum alles nach seinem Geschmack umgebaut haben will.
brigens haben Normies, die sich einer bestehenden Community anschlossen, aber keinen Bock hatten, sich einzugliedern, auf diese Weise schon so manch ein Fandom und so manch eine Community zu Fall gebracht, indem sie ganz einfach irgendwann die Mehrheit stellten.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost
Und genau die kommen von den Leuten, fr die das Fediverse entweder ausschlielich aus Mastodon besteht oder ausschlielich aus Mastodon bestehen sollte.
Das tut es brigens nicht. Ich hoffe, das liest du jetzt nicht nach zweieinhalb Jahren zum allerersten Mal, aber das Fediverse ist nicht nur Mastodon. Der eine User, auf den du geantwortet hast, ist auf Friendica und nicht auf Mastodon. Und ich antworte dir von Hubzilla.
Und so leid es mir tut, aber einige der Anmerkungen waren durchaus gerechtfertigt, wenngleich sie dir vielleicht etwas sehr oberlehrerhaft oder gar bergriffig vorkamen.
Tatsache ist: Nicht jeder im Fediverse trtet. Denn nicht jeder im Fediverse ist auf Mastodon. Friendica, wo ist, ist nicht Mastodon. Hubzilla, wo ich bin, ist auch nicht Mastodon. Beide sind zwar im Fediverse und mit Mastodon verbunden, haben aber mit Mastodon nicht das Geringste zu tun, sie sind vllig anders als Mastodon und sind auch nicht nachtrglich an Mastodon drangebaut worden, sondern tatschlich sogar lter als Mastodon.
Folglich trten die Nutzer auf Friendica und Hubzilla nicht, ebensowenig wie die Nutzer von Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Calckey, Firefish, CherryPick, Iceshrimp, Sharkey, Catodon, Mitra, GoToSocial, Socialhome, micro.blog, (streams), Forte usw. usf. Die sind aber auch alle im Fediverse, und die sind (fast) alle mit Mastodon verbunden.
Tatsache ist auch: Das Fediverse-Projekt, also die Serveranwendung, die du nutzt, die heit zwar Mastodon. Aber das ganze Netzwerk heit eben nicht Mastodon. Wie Der Pepe (Hubzilla) aus gegebenem Anla auf seinem Blog schrieb und auf seinem Kanal PepeCyB's Welt (beides auf Hubzilla, aber sehr wohl Teil des Fediverse) verteilte: ""
Wer auch immer dich da korrigiert hat, noch dazu auf eine Art und Weise, die dich verwirrt haben drfte, hat sich vermutlich ganz einfach daran gestrt, da du zwar mglicherweise das ganze Fediverse gemeint hast, es aber als "Mastodon" bezeichnet hast.
Nicht ffentlich zu antworten, scheint mir wiederum der Versuch zu sein, etwas durchzusetzen, wovon irgendjemand glaubt, es sei Teil der Fediquette und der Mastodon-Kultur. Denn auch wenn das auf Mastodon noch ginge: Je weiter man sich im Fediverse von Mastodon entfernt, desto weniger ist das berhaupt mglich.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NichtNurMastodon #Fediquette #MastodonKultur
Es gibt nmlich auch , eine Facebook-Alternative aus derselben Familie wie auch Friendica und Hubzilla vom selben Entwickler. Es ist mit voller Absicht offiziell namenlos, es hat keine Markenidentitt, und mit derselben vollen Absicht ist Nodeinfo fast komplett entfernt worden. Damit gibt es auch keinen vereinheitlichten Identifikator wie "mastodon" oder "hubzilla". Jede Instanz kann nicht nur einen eigenen Namen haben, sondern auch einen eigenen individuellen Identifikator, wo jeder gesunde Mensch von allen Instanzen dasselbe vereinheitlichte "streams" erwarten wrde.
Zum einen mtest du also deine Liste immer nachpflegen, wenn wieder irgendjemand Misskey oder einen Misskey-Fork geforkt hat oder so. Zum anderen mtest du in deiner Liste auch den Identifikator von jeder einzelnen (streams)-Instanz eintragen, der sich brigens auch mal ndern kann.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Streams #(streams) #nodeinfo
Celebrate consciously with us in this months Holiday Edition of Kids Zone Magazine! With info on Covid and a Pacing Penguins matching activity, printables, recipes, art, comics, and a spotlight on educators, you wont want to miss this issue!
Check out Issue 5 at:
I think I can say I've got quite a lot of experience in describing images and upping my game from description to description, always trying to keep up with people's requirements or what requirements I extrapolate from what they write. I don't post images often, but that's due to the gigantic effort I tend to put into describing images. That's mostly because what I post about with images is always a rather obscure niche topic.This includes not only original renderings from 3-D virtual worlds with two image descriptions each, but also Fediverse memes. For the latter, I've actually launched . It is absolutely part of the Fediverse, it is federated with Mastodon both in theory and in practice, it can be followed from Mastodon, and therefore, it must adhere to the rules of the Fediverse as much as possible with something that isn't Mastodon.
Now, my meme posts aren't usually easy to understand, not even for Fediverse users, because I tend to dive deep into the Fediverse, far beyond Mastodon. Thus, the topics of my posts may require a lot of explanation. Also, I can't always expect everyone to a) be familiar with and b) understand the template(s) I use. So, these require a lot of explanation, too.
My experience of more than one year of improving my image descriptions is that many Fediverse users, especially Mastodon users, love having all kinds of information served to them on a silver platter without them even having to ask. And so I try to provide all information needed to understand my meme posts with next to no prior knowledge.
However, I don't do so in the alt-text. The visual description, complete with full, 100% verbatim transcripts of all texts added in the image macro, goes into the alt-text, yes. But the explanations don't.
First of all, and this is very important: Explanations do not belong into alt-text because not everyone can access alt-text. There can be many reasons why someone can't access alt-text, including a variety of physical disabilities which make it impossible for people to move and hold a mouse cursor over an image. But if they can't access alt-text, information exclusively available in the alt-text and neither in the post nor in the image is inaccessible and therefore lost to them.
In addition, my explanations are too long for alt-text. That is, they aren't too long for alt-text on (streams) which technically has no character limit. But Mastodon, Misskey and their respective forks would chop it off at the 1,500-character mark. And besides, even on (streams) itself, the maximum amount of alt-text that can be read is limited itself, depending on the user interface, because it can't be scrolled.
Finally, my explanations tend to grow too long for screen readers. Having a screen reader read out 1,500 characters of alt-text with no possibility to navigate that chunk of text, e.g. jump back to a certain sentence in the alt-text, is inconvenient. Now imagine using a screen reader to read several tens of thousands of characters.
And so I've decided to do the same with my meme explanations as I do with my long image descriptions for my original images: I put them into the post itself. I don't have any character limit there either, and nothing will truncate my extremely long posts.
This was particularly important for my first attempt at a new meme-posting format, . From what I've caught over the months, the Fediverse in general preferred having all explanations for an image in one place, the same place as the image itself, over links to external explanations. And so I tried to explain that image as in-depth as possible with as few external links as possible for as little prior knowledge as I could expect from Fediverse users.
Of course, I had to explain the image itself. But all by itself, that explanation wasn't exactly comprehensible because it would have required knowledge from two niches, namely about the template and about the topic.
And so I explained the template on a level not much lower than KnowYourMeme. But in order to make that explanation comprehensible, I also had to explain image macros, snowclones and advice animals. In order to make these comprehensible, I had to explain Something Awful, 4chan and imageboards in general in addition. The template explanations alone are over 10,000 characters long.
But would you know what FEP-ef61 is Would you know what nomadic identity is Would you know what (streams) is Probably not. Probably not even by Googling them.
And so I had to explain the topic as well. FEP-ef61. The concept of nomadic identity, what it is, what it does, how it works, what it's good for, why it was even created. The streams repository. Hubzilla. I've even rattled down the whole 14-year history from Mistpark/Friendica to the Red Matrix to Hubzilla to three different Osadas, Zap, another Mistpark and another Redmatrix to Roadhouse to the streams repository to what was the present time then, just so that people who only just recently thought the Fediverse equals Mastodon understand what (streams) is and where it comes from. Another 13,000 characters with a high information density.
Preamble included, the explanation of this one measly image that isn't even that complex clocked in at almost 25,000 characters. So I thought that couldn't possibly be what Mastodon users want. You know, the kind of people who are used to 1/50th of that in one post, not few of whom already go ballistic if you put 600 characters in one post.
So I ran on how people want meme posts to be explained. This time, I also mentioned what would be how long. Nobody really wanted such massive explanations. A few preferred externally linked explanations. Most didn't even want links, probably because they thought I'd put the links into the alt-text, because they couldn't imagine an image being described anyplace else than the alt-text.
Anyway, I still think I owe them explanations, also seeing as what I make memes about tends to be so obscure and/or recent that you really can't Google your explanation together.
So what I currently do is: As for meme templates, I link to the appropriate KnowYourMeme pages. As for the topic, if there's something I can link to, I link to it. Otherwise, if it needs to be explained, I explain it.
This can range from nothing more than mentioning the template and linking to KYM like for to several thousand characters of explanations because the topic is so obscure for or several thousand characters of explanations because I've combined seven meme template with a very complex and techy topic that involves seven Fediverse server applications (and one on the fringe) to make .
As you can see, it's tremendously difficult to make Fediverse meme posts understandable for total normies who think the Fediverse is only Mastodon and at the same time easy and convenient enough to consume for those who do not want to read thousands upon thousands of characters in a meme post.
By the way, if you think that 25,000 characters of explanation are absolutely, incredibly hypermassive: As I've said at the beginning, my original virtual world renderings get two image descriptions. A short one in the alt-text which recently always ends up at exactly 1,500 characters or only a few characters short. And a long one which may exceed (content warning for the link: eye contact, food) or, in one case, characters for one image, including visual descriptions, text transcripts and explanations, also because the explanations cannot be separated from the visual descriptions. And I've actually limited myself in the 60,000-character case.
It's only when I go to great lengths to reduce the details in images that I can make do with something like (content warning for the link: eye contact) . I need the explanations nonetheless. And I've actually decided against making certain images, much less posting them, because the scenery was too complex to sensibly describe and explain.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #AltText #AltTextMeta #CWAltTextMeta #ImageDescription #ImageDescriptions #ImageDescriptionMeta #CWImageDescriptionMeta #Memes
Dolphins In Depth: Dolphins reinforcements are on the way
Attention-Worthy Links for December 3rd, 2024
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LongNew entry of AI-generated and added to our :
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Das Fediverse selbst hatte eine wesentlich bessere Idee und die existiert noch immer. Das ist das Thema der gegenseitigen Interessen. Dabei gebe ich in meinem Profil ein, was mich interessiert und worber ich mich mit anderen Menschen austauschen will. Die Installation sucht nun nach Matches auf anderen Servern und stellt dir diese Kontakte vor. Du kannst diesen Kontakten folgen.
Problem ist nur: Was der Vogelkfig nicht kann, kann Mastodon auch nicht. Und was Mastodon nicht kann, kann praktisch das ganze Fediverse nicht.
Und das kann der Vogelkfig nicht. Also kann Mastodon das auch nicht. Also existiert fr die allermeisten das Feature im ganzen Fediverse nicht.
Und trotzdem wird Mastodon hufiger als nicht als "soziales Netzwerk" bezeichnet.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #NichtNurMastodon #SozialesNetzwerk
If you prefer to sleep alone, you can opt for a Australia-wide, from specialised stores that provide a wide range of high-quality designs specifically made for tall adults or growing teens.
- I the sack. Ive been too , Im glad to be !
Dolphins In Depth: Can Dolphins get off the mat after being KOed by Packers
Keon le chien avec la plus longue queue du monde
Looking at the numbers, Mastodon is the fediverse.
Mastodon's dominance in numbers comes from only Mastodon even receiving any exposure outside the Fediverse and, in fact, even within Mastodon.
People who want to leave are only being told about Mastodon. Mostly from Mastodon users who, in turn, have yet to learn that the Fediverse is more than Mastodon itself.
Tech media like , mass media, even many bloggers talk about Mastodon, but they barely even mention the Fediverse, and they almost never mention anything else that's in the Fediverse. Except maybe if it's commercial like Flipboard, or if its self-advertisement is as ubiquitous as Pixelfed's.
Only Japanese escapees join Misskey which is the reason why Misskey is not exactly small.
Literally nobody from outside the Fediverse ever joins Pleroma. Or Akkoma. Or Firefish. Or Iceshrimp. Or Sharkey.
Not because they're bad. But because literally nobody even knows that they exist. Because nobody is being told about their existence. Because those who communicate to people outside the Fediverse mostly don't know themselves that they exist. Or if they do know, which is super rare, they don't talk about them to keep things nice and simple.
If Facebook should ever end up being so enshittified that a mass exodus kicks in in spite of all that "but muh friends are here", all the Facebook refugees will end up on Mastodon, too. Literally absolutely all of them.
Not because Mastodon is perfect for them. The Fediverse's primary Facebook alternative is Friendica and has been since 2010. It's worlds closer to Facebook than Mastodon.
But the migration wave will be driven forward by thousands upon thousands of Mastodon users, almost none of whom have ever heard of Friendica, much less that it's connected to Mastodon, the vast majority of whom is fully convinced that the Fediverse is only Mastodon, and the tiny rest of whom hates Friendica with a burning passion for having the audacity of being so different from Mastodon.
That and the fact, that AP services do not work well together.
Well, part of this comes from Mastodon's refusal to be more compatible with the rest of the Fediverse and insistance in adding more and more non-standard, proprietary features which aren't compatible with the rest of the Fediverse.
In addition, Mastodon is so dominant that the vast majority of Fediverse users sees it as the one and only ActivityPub gold standard. Even if they learn about the Fediverse outside of Mastodon and stop denying its existence, they still think that Eugen Rochko has invented not only Mastodon, but also the Fediverse and ActivityPub because it couldn't possibly have been any different. So to them, everything that isn't Mastodon was made after Mastodon as an add-on bolted onto Mastodon.
From this come two misconceptions.
One, everything works just like Mastodon. If it doesn't, that's a bug that needs to be fixed. Including, for example, the way literally everything that isn't Mastodon or one of its forks handles conversations (or the fact that it handles conversations at all).
Two, everything is made to work with Mastodon. Mastodon users expect being able to follow Lemmy users. Because Lemmy is Mastodon's Reddit-style add-on, right What do you mean, you can't follow Lemmy users That's a bug that needs to be fixed, and as long as it isn't fixed, Lemmy is bad and broken. Never mind that Redditors can't follow other Redditors. It's a Mastodon add-on, and so it has to work by Mastodon's rules.
And that's only the raw technological side. On top comes the tendency of many Mastodon users to try and force Mastodon's culture and Mastodon's "Fediquette" upon the rest of the Fediverse. A culture and an "etiquette" that have both always completely ignored the whole rest of the Fediverse because they were largely coined by Mastodon users who, at that point, were blissfully unaware of Mastodon being connected to anything that isn't Mastodon.
More than 500 characters Not allowed in the Mastodon Fediverse. , Calckey user with thousands of characters at his disposal, was once commanded by a Mastodon fundamentalist to either limit all his posts to a maximum of 500 characters or get the fuck out of the Fediverse. True story.
Text formatting Disturbing, makes "toots" harder to read, but most of all, un-Mastodon-like, thus not allowed.
Replying to people who haven't mentioned you, and who aren't mutually connected to you Perfectly normal everywhere else and integral part of the culture of Fediverse projects that pre-date Mastodon by years. On Mastodon, it's reply-guying, an offence so grave and severe that it may justify moderation to step in.
Now, as a Mastodon user, you may wonder what's so bad about all this. I mean, all of us non-Mastodon users could easily adopt Mastodon's culture. And throw the culture of what we use overboard. No matter if it's years older than Mastodon itself, not to mention Mastodon's current culture. No matter if it's better geared towards what we use. Oh, and, of course, stop using 80-95% of the features of whatever we use.
Well, what'd you say if more and more Bluesky users demanded Mastodon users keep all their posts at 300 characters or below Or what'd you say if Threads federated fully, and then Threads users started trying to push Threads' culture upon Mastodon on the ground of Threads users being the majority now
I guess you'd defederate. While protesting loudly.
Well, then don't complain about users of Friendica (over five years older than Mastodon and federated with Mastodon for as long as Mastodon has been around) who are angry about obnoxious Mastodon users who try to force them to use Friendica like Mastodon.
And don't complain about Hubzilla or (streams) users loudly announcing that they turn ActivityPub off on their channels with the explicit intent of keeping Mastodon's toxic and ignorant supremacy out. (By the way, I know one (streams) discussion group that actually does have ActivityPub off for this very reason.)
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverseHubzilla can give Fediverse content more reach. The same applies to (streams), it will apply to Forte, and I guess it applies to Friendica as well.
You just need a whole bunch of connections, and you need to come across Fediverse content in irregular ways, e.g. by receiving posts with links to other posts or subscribing to a hashtag RSS feed on mastodon.social (the latter doesn't work on (streams) and Forte).
If you discover a post that needs more feedback (or any feedback in the first place), especially from the kind of people whom you're connected to, just copy its URL and then search for it. This way, you manually import it onto your stream.
Once you see it, repeat it.
If you've got enough reach yourself, you can now watch that post be repeated/boosted/renoted/reposted and ideally also commented on.
It's with this trick that I've actually helped join Friendica.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Boost #Boosts #FediTips Gerade mit Facebook wird das nicht klappen.
Friendica kann ja bis heute Konten einbinden von Bluesky, Tumblr und letzteres natrlich nur, wenn der Node-Admin Millionr ist und sich die API-Lizenz leisten kann, aber das Feature ist vollumfnglich da. Friendica kann sich auch mit allem mglichen anderen Kram verbinden.
2012 konnte Friendica sich auf dieselbe Art und Weise tatschlich sogar mit Facebook verbinden. Wenn die entsprechende Erweiterung auf einem Node aktiviert war (wofr der Node-Admin auf Facebook als Entwickler registriert sein mute), konnte man sein Facebook-Konto in Friendica einbinden. Der Facebook-Feed wurde Teil dessen auf Friendica. Die Facebook-Freunde wurden Friendica-Kontakte. Man konnte Facebook nutzen, ohne Facebook zu nutzen. Man konnte gleichzeitig innerhalb von Friendica und nach StatusNet, diaspora*, Twitter, Tumblr und Facebook posten und dann Antworten von berall da bekommen.
Die Idee dahinter war zweifach. Zum einen war Facebook eh noch ein fehlender Baustein in Friendicas "Wir fderieren mit allem, was nicht bei drei auf den Bumen ist"-Prinzip.
Zum anderen war die Idee, da eine Verbindung zwischen Friendica und Facebook es Facebook-Nutzern leichter machen sollte, zu Friendica zu wechseln. Erst sollten sie auf Friendica ihr Facebook-Konto einbinden. Dann sollten ihre Freunde auch so nach und nach nach Friendica kommen. Und wenn dann irgendwann ihre Freunde alle auf Friendica sind, sollten sie selbst die Facebook-Einbindung abschalten und ihr Facebook-Konto lschen knnen, weil sie es dann nicht mehr brauchen wrden.
Dieses Vorgehen hat Facebook aber gemerkt. Und das pate ihnen nicht. Also haben sie Gegenmanahmen ergriffen.
Nach einiger Zeit haben sie ihre Regeln fr Dritt-Apps gendert, und Friendica zhlte als solche. Dritt-Apps durften weiterhin Inhalte nach Facebook senden, aber keine Inhalte mehr extrahieren. Zuwiderhandlungen fhrten zum sofortigen und unwiderruflichen Verlust des Entwicklerstatus.
Einige Node-Admins haben das Facebook-Add-on bald wieder abgeschaltet, zumal das eh horrende viele Serverressourcen fra. Friendica-Nodes mit aktivem Facebook-Add-on haben meistens schon bei zwischen 130 und 140 Nutzern die Registrierung geschlossen, weil sie voll waren.
Andere haben es laufen lassen, gerade auch, weil ihre Nutzer es eifrig in Benutzung hatten. Sie haben einfach riskiert, da Facebook sie erwischt und ihnen den Hahn abdreht. Dann wre es eh egal gewesen, dann htten sie den Entwicklerstatus eh nicht mehr gebraucht. Bis dahin sollte der noch in Benutzung bleiben.
Von den Friendica-Entwicklern kam dann ein alternatives Facebook-Add-on, das nur noch in eine Richtung als reiner Crossposter funktionierte. Das ist praktisch berhaupt nicht angenommen worden, weil es letztlich ziemlich sinnfrei war. Im Grunde schien es nur zu existieren, damit Friendica von sich behaupten konnte, sich weiterhin mit Facebook verbinden zu knnen.
Sptestens 2014 drften beide Add-ons wieder komplett verschwunden gewesen sein. Und bis heute drfte Facebook seine Regeln fr Drittanwendungen nicht wieder so gelockert haben, da Friendica die volle Fderation wieder wagen knnte.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Friendica #Facebook
Und selbst die follower fr heise.de sind nicht alles Mastodonbenutzer.
Ich wrde ja sagen: "Bald sind sie es", weil dieses Verhalten so manch einem Fediverse-aber-nicht-Mastodon-Nutzer auf den Geist geht. Aber ich glaube, die bleiben bei der Stange, auch um diese Falschbehauptungen bei jeder Gelegenheit widerlegen zu knnen.
Manchmal fhrt zu viel Vereinfachung nur zu falschen Darstellungen.
Und zu noch mehr Leuten, die "wissen", da das Fediverse nur Mastodon ist, weil ihnen das entweder suggeriert oder direktweg so gesagt wurde.
Und zu noch mehr Entwicklern, die Sachen fr "das Fediverse" entwickeln, die dann so hart nur gegen Mastodon hartgecodet sind, da sie schon mit Akkoma oder Firefish nicht mehr funktionieren.
Und zu noch mehr Leuten, die sich so ans Mastodon-Fediverse gewhnt haben, da sie sich mit Zhnen, Klauen und Blocks gegen alle Hinweise wehren, da das Fediverse eben nicht nur Mastodon ist. Und davon gibt es nun wirklich jetzt schon nicht wenige.
Und zu noch mehr Fundamentalisten, die im ganzen Fediverse eine Kultur und eine Etikette zwangsweise durchzusetzen versuchen, die nur auf Mastodon und seinen Features aufbaut. Die Nutzern z. B. des ber fnf Jahre lteren Friendica, das berhaupt nicht wie Mastodon ist und um Grenordnungen mchtiger, vorzuschreiben versuchen, Friendica genau wie Mastodon zu benutzen, locker 80% von Friendicas Features nicht mehr zu verwenden, Friendicas sehr viel ltere Kultur ber Bord zu werfen und sich ausschlielich an Mastodons Kultur zu halten.
Das sind keine Hirngespinste. Ich knnte hier Leute erwhnen, insbesondere auf Friendica, die schon hart mit "Fediverse = Mastodon"-Leuten aneinandergeraten sind.
Und wenn sagt, das fr ihn gefhlt 90% Mastodon im Fediverse ist, so ist das von meinem Zugang aber nicht so.
Das ist leider generell auf Mastodon so. Mastodon stellt 70% der User, aber gefhlt ber 95% des Traffic auf Mastodon kommen von Mastodon. Es gibt Mastodon-Nutzer, die folgen hunderten Mastodon-Nutzern und keinem einzigen Nicht-Mastodon-Nutzer. Man kann zwei Jahre auf Mastodon verbringen, hunderten Leuten folgen und keinen einzigen Beitrag je zu Gesicht bekommen, der nicht von Mastodon kommt.
Auch viele unntze Diskussionen htte es nicht gegeben, wenn man nicht nur immer Mastodon, sondern auch die anderen Dienste erwhnt htte, die das alles haben, was die Twitterflchtlinge gesucht haben und mit eurer Zugangssoftware, nicht bekommen haben.
Beispielsweise ber Features, die Mastodon-Nutzer gerne im "Fediverse" htten, die aber im Fediverse auerhalb von Mastodon schon seit Jahren verfgbar sind.
Oder ber Features, die Mastodon-Nutzer auf gar keinen Fall im "Fediverse" haben wollen, die das Fediverse aber auerhalb von Mastodon lngst hat. Z. B. Volltextsuche oder Drkos/Drukos.
Oder ber Verhaltensweisen, die auf Friendica schon einige Jahre lnger gang und gbe sind, als es Mastodon berhaupt gibt, die aber in Mastodons das gesamte brige Fediverse als nichtexistent ansehender Kultur ein schwerwiegendes und unbedingt zu sanktionierendes Fehlverhalten sind. Z. B. Antworten auf Beitrgen von Leuten, die einen weder erwhnt haben noch mit einem gegenseitig verbunden sind.
Das #Fediverse ist schon ein tolles Netzwerk, das soltle man auch als solches beschreiben und nicht auf den kleinsten Nenner reduzieren und sich dann ber kritsche Gegenargumente wundern
Dieses Wundern kommt ja gerade daher, da jeder, der neu ins Fediverse kommt, lernt, da "Fediverse" und "Mastodon" gegenseitig vlllig gleichbedeutend sind, und sich dann ber Monate genau daran gewhnt.
Entsprechend abrupt reagieren viele, wenn sie mit der Wahrheit konfrontiert werden. Ob es ihnen einfach jemand ungefragt sagt (fragen wrden sie ja eh nicht) oder sie auf einen Beitrag in ihrer Timeline stoen, der so auf gar keinen Fall von Mastodon kommen kann (ber 500 Zeichen, Textformatierung, Punktliste, Zitat, Drko/Druko o. .), ist egal.
Und so steigt leider nicht nur die Zahl derjenigen kontinuierlich an, die "wissen", da das Fediverse nur Mastodon ist, und das berhaupt nicht in Frage stellen, sondern auch die Zahl derjenigen, die sich regelrecht gegen Informationen ber die Existenz eines Fediverse auerhalb von Mastodon zur Wehr setzen.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NichtNurMastodon It's sad that it's always Bluesky, Threads and Mastodon. The Fediverse is only represented by Mastodon, only Mastodon and nothing but Mastodon, as if there's nothing else. Always.
The Fediverse's quality in microblogging is always measured in what vanilla Mastodon can and can't do. If Mastodon lacks something, the Fediverse lacks it.
But the Fediverse is not only Mastodon. Not even in terms of microblogging.
Pleroma is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Akkoma is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Misskey is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Firefish is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Iceshrimp is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Sharkey is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Catodon is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
Mitra is microblogging, part of the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon.
And that's only a selection.
None of them are related to Mastodon. None of them have even a grain of Mastodon in them. They're fully independent developments.
Feature-wise, they all blow Bluesky and Threads and Mastodon out of the water. In fact, if you want "the Fediverse", read, Mastodon to have a certain feature, Misskey probably has it right now. If Misskey doesn't, Iceshrimp or Sharkey may have it. And that doesn't say anything about the more Facebook-like and even more powerful parts of the Fediverse yet.
If Mastodon wants to evolve, it will first have to catch up to the rest of the Fediverse.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Pleroma #Akkoma #Misskey #Firefish #Iceshrimp #Sharkey #Catodon #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverse Schwierig.
Friendica ist ja das einzige, was keine Brcke braucht. Aber auch Friendica ist kein Bluesky-PDS und schon gar kein kompletter PDS/Relay/AppView-Stack. Da mu man immer noch ein Bluesky-Konto einbinden.
Wenn man das im Diagramm bercksichtigen will, dann brauchen auch , Tumblr und Libertree eigene Kreise mit eigenen Farben. Ja, . Wenn du als Node-Admin die Millionen hast fr einen vollwertigen API-Key, kannst du deinen Friendica-Node voll mit verbinden, und die Nutzer auf deinem Node knnen ihre -Konten da einbinden. Das ist zwar schweineteuer, funktioniert aber noch, also kein Grund, das rauszuwerfen.
Und es bruchte eigene Kreise mit eigener Farbe fr die WordPress XMLRPC API, denn von Friendica und Hubzilla aus kann man zu WordPress-Blogs crossposten und brigens auch von WordPress nach Friendica.
Im Grunde wren da Kreise fr GNU social und XMPP (was ja selbst eigentlich nur ein Protokoll ist) sogar noch angebrachter, ebenso fr RSS/Atom, denn Friendica und Hubzilla knnen auch RSS- und Atom-Feeds abonnieren. Bei letzterem bruchte es dann aber Richtungspfeile.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta
one thing we could do in the short term is stop saying server and start saying community.
On the one hand, that's what the (streams) predecessor Roadhouse already did from when it was launched in early 2021 on. (streams) and Forte do the same.
On the other hand, the more widespread definition of "community" is the Lemmy equivalent of a subreddit. So if you want Lemmy to refer to its instances as "communities", it first needs to find a new name for its discussion groups.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Roadhouse #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Lemmy #Communities
is friendica/ hubzilla open source
They're all free and open-source.
was originally under the MIT license and was relicensed by the community under the GNU Affero GPL v3 in 2012.
is under the MIT license.
(streams) is under the MIT license.
Forte is under the MIT license, too.
All of them are also as decentralised as Mastodon. That is, Forte still isn't officially ready for prime time it's only used by its developer so far.
Also, (streams) never really took off because it's too uninteresting for the Hubzilla crowd, and hardly anyone else even knows about it. And the already small number of public instances shrunk further this summer. So it's basically currently down to only one recommendable public instance with open registration, and even there you'll have to give a reason why you want to join.
how do you deal with staleness (meaning: you have preauthorized responders, but that naturally decays over time while n00bs, some of which suck, some of which are cool, are unable to respond, so there is no inflow of new responders)
By giving cool n00bs who connect to you permission to comment on your posts.
That said, limiting comment permission is a last resort because it means that the general public can't reply to your posts anymore, only a select few of your contacts. This means you'll inevitably end up in a very small bubble.
Unfortunately, you can't deny permissions to specific users which are granted to the general public. Also, granting permissions requires a connection.
So if you don't want to "punish" the general public for what a few people do, if you do want the general public to reply to you, the only way to get rid of specific reply guys is to block them. This is also the only way to get rid of people reply-guying your comments on other people's posts.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte If you want to max out user safety in the Fediverse, do not place all your bets on Mastodon!
Again: The Fediverse is not only Mastodon. The Fediverse isn't Mastodon with stuff bolted onto Mastodon either.
There's a whole lot of stuff in the Fediverse that's developed fully independently from Mastodon. There's stuff that's older than Mastodon. There's stuff that's a whole lot different from Mastodon. And "different" doesn't mean "wrong". Mastodon is not the Fediverse's quality standard. No, really, it isn't.
One issue that you've mentioned are reply guys. What you seem to be looking for is a technological barrier that's absolute, 100% water-tight safety from reply-guying.
This means that you'll have to go with Mastodon's re-definition of a reply guy: anyone who replies to you without being mutually connected to you, and without having been mentioned by you in the post which that person replies to. Because by Mastodon's standards, it shouldn't even be possible for such a post to show up on your timeline.
But, again, the Fediverse is not only Mastodon. Nor does the Fediverse in its entirety work like Mastodon. Especially in this regard. Not everything in the Fediverse tries to mimic Twitter.
For example, Friendica. Friendica is a Facebook alternative that was launched in 2010. And when Mastodon was launched, it immediately federated itself with a Friendica which, at that point, was five and a half years old and had its own living, breathing culture based on its own technology. Which is vastly different from Mastodon.
Friendica doesn't think in single posts loosely tied together. Friendica thinks in full conversations. Whereas Mastodon doesn't even know what a conversation is.
And: On Friendica, if you receive a post, you receive the whole thread. With all comments.
Let's suppose you follow Alice. Alice sends a post. Bob comments on the post. Carol comments on the post. But Bob and Carol don't mention you, and you don't follow them.
On Mastodon, you only see Alice's post.
On Friendica, you see Alice's post, Bob's comment and Carol's comment. With no following, with no mentions. Because you've received Alice's post, you also receive all comments.
This is not a bug. This is absolutely intentional. For this is how Facebook works which Friendica aims to replace. It has always been this way. And it's deeply engrained in Friendica's culture.
This also means that anyone on Friendica can and does comment on comments by people who haven't mentioned them and whom they don't follow, just because these people have commented on something someone wrote whom these Friendica users follow.
Oh, and by the way: Hubzilla, a fork of Friendica by Friendica's creator from 2015, works the same. (streams), a fork of a fork of three forks of a fork (of a fork) of Hubzilla by Friendica's and Hubzilla's creator from 2021, works the same. Forte, a fork of (streams) by still the same creator from this year, works the same.
They're all part of the Fediverse, and they're all federated with Mastodon. I'm writing to you from Hubzilla right now.
In fact, Pleroma and its various forks, particularly Akkoma, knows conversations, too. Misskey and its many forks, including but not limited to Calckey/Firefish, Sharkey, CherryPick, Iceshrimp, Catodon, Neko, Meisskey, Tanukey etc., all know conversations. Again, they're all part of the Fediverse, and they're all federated with Mastodon.
So first of all, we have a difference in culture based on a difference in technology and use-case.
Of course, the natural reaction of many Mastodon users would be to put the proverbial gun against the chests of everything that isn't Mastodon and try to force it to become another Mastodon and ditch up to 90% of its features because Mastodon doesn't have them, and to force everyone who isn't on Mastodon to use whatever they have exactly like Mastodon. Believe me, I know people to whom this has actually happened. I could mention them.
You can try. But you can't expect it to work. No, seriously, you can't.
As for a technological barrier: If you want it installed on Mastodon, it won't work. Not with a Fediverse that isn't entirely Mastodon.
It might work with a proper permissions system like on Hubzilla or (streams) or Forte, and even that only if it was made into an FEP, a quasi-standard, and all the Fediverse adopted this system in fully compatible ways. And even that would only give you the power to define
- whether people may generally comment on your posts, or whether nobody or only a select few may
- who of your connections may comment on your posts
- if it's more like Hubzilla, whether or not anyone is permitted to comment on the post that you're just writing
This, however, means:
- The permissions system does not distinguish between people whom you've mentioned and people whom you haven't mentioned. Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte don't rely on mentions.
- You can only define whether someone may reply to your posts. As in anything that isn't a reply. Replies aren't posts in this system. They're comments. Whether someone may reply to your comments is defined by whoever sent the post that you've just commented on. They own the whole conversation. They define all permissions in the conversation. And since you could comment on that post, probably anyone can, otherwise you couldn't either.
Speaking of permissions: If you want safety, ditch that underwhelming, intentionally lack-lustre and hopelessly outdated kluge that's Mastodon and look elsewhere in the Fediverse where the real innovations are made.
Imagine you, as a user, could generally define
- who is allowed to see your personal timeline and your toots
- who is allowed to send you their toots
- who is allowed to fave and reply to your toots
- who is allowed to send you DMs
- who is allowed to see your profile
- who is allowed to see your followers and followed
- who is allowed to boost and quote-toot your toots
Also, Mastodon only has everybody and nobody as options. Now imagine you can generally grant any permission to
- everyone on the Internet (only where this is possible and makes sense)
- everyone in the Fediverse
- everyone on Hubzilla
- everyone on this instance
- everyone who wants to follow you or whom you follow (there's no "who follows you")
- everyone whom you follow
- only those whom you follow whom you explicitly grant that permission
- only you yourself
Yes, "whom you explicitly grant that permission". Imagine you can grant permissions individually to certain contacts and not to other contacts.
Imagine you can be mutually connected with Alice, but still keep Alice from sending you her toots. Imagine you can disallow Alice and Bob, both mutual connections of yours, to see your profile, but you can allow Carol to see it.
Science-fiction No.
This has been reality on Hubzilla since 2012, for a dozen years, almost four years longer than Mastodon has been around. Permissions are everything on Hubzilla.
This is not experimental. This is rock-solid technology, daily-driven by thousands of Fediverse users. This is technology available in the Fediverse right now.
(streams) and Forte have a similar, compatible permissions system, only that the controls are different, and a few permissions are different. They have an additional permission setting for searching your posts, and they even let you allow or disallow individual contacts to send you boosts. Also, the only general, channel-wide permissions levels they have are
- everyone on the Internet
- everyone in the Fediverse
- those whom you follow (and even then only if you explicitly grant this permission to them individually)
- nobody except you
That said, these permissions have their limitations outside the Hubzilla/(streams)/Forte ecosystem. They can keep certain unwanted things out, but they can't keep them from happening.
For example, let's suppose you're on (streams), and you only let certain people comment on your posts. If someone is on Hubzilla or (streams) and receives one of your posts, and that someone isn't permitted to comment on it, certain UI elements for replying are removed for them, and so they can't reply.
But neither Hubzilla nor (streams) nor Forte can make UI elements disappear on Mastodon or on Misskey or on Iceshrimp or on Akkoma or elsewhere. In other words, a Mastodon user can still reply to you. You'll never receive that reply. If you're the only recipient of that reply on your instance, the whole instance rejects the reply. But still, that reply is made and sent. At the very least, it ends up on the replier's timeline and the local timeline of their Mastodon instance.
There's only one way for the Fediverse to become significantly safer: This kind of permissions system must be turned into an FEP, and it must remain fully compatible with the existing implementations. And the whole Fediverse, vanilla Mastodon included, must implement it to its full extent.
Yes, this makes the Fediverse harder to use.
But seriously, you can't expect your real-life home to be safer than Fort Knox while you're still able to walk in and out anytime without even having to open one single door.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta
also exists and is a bit more in-depth than what I had in mind.
It's also a very early, very, very unfinished and very, very, very incomplete draft. I should know, I should be working on it, and I have already put a lot of work into the layout and especially the Hubzilla data. Expect not only more software and more data, but even more tables, and expect some of the existing tables to change. Not to mention that I'll have to find a way to make these tables fit into the layout without losing information.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Wiki
From 26 Nov: Long COVID Hits the Young Harder Than the Old, Study Finds Research Shows Younger & Middle-Aged Adults Have Worse Long COVID Symptoms Than Older Adults - -covid -19
If anything, you should use both.Mastodon has the option to use filters to not only remove posts, but also to hide them behind a button like a content warning. This feature has been available for two years now.
Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte have a separate, optional feature called "NSFW" that uses its own keyword list to hide certain content behind a button. It has been their preferred way of issuing content warnings since Friendica's inception in 2010, even though Mastodon's repurposing of StatusNet's summary field (which is still a summary on all four) as a CW field since 2017 is dominant nowadays.
But of course, they all need something in the post to trigger it. It doesn't have to be a hashtag, but a hashtag is safe because it's easy to add to a post without having to bend the wording of the actual post so that it contains the right keywords to trigger the right filters.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Filters #FediTips #Hashtag #Hashtags The hashtag would be
#EyeContact
And, in addition to the one above, if you really want to drive the point home that the hashtag is there with a content-warning function to a) trigger post-removing/post-rejecting filters, b) trigger post-hiding filters on Mastodon and c) trigger the "NSFW" post-hiding feature on Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte:
#CWEyeContact
I don't think there's any consensus on whether #CW and #ContentWarning should be used as actual content warning hashtags or for content warning discussions, which should be tagged #CWs, #ContentWarnings, #CWMeta and/or #ContentWarningMeta, or for both. I mean, apart from #CW being constantly used for either "continuous wave" in amateur radiotelegraphy or the CW Television network.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #Friendica #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #Filters #FediTips #Hashtag #Hashtags
Dolphins In Depth: Dolphins focused on silencing negative narratives
Mastodon customs like content warnings and ALT text, however compelling their motivations, need to be presented as best practices NOT moral obligations.
Especially since the Fediverse is not only Mastodon, and not everything in the Fediverse works the same.
If Mastodon-style content warnings become mandatory to the point of instance blocks as punishment, you may go about and Fediblock the entirety of with all its instances because it currently has no working means of adding Mastodon-style content warnings to replies.
I myself have to make do with hashtags and hoping that people know how to use filters. Over here on Hubzilla, we do content warnings reader-side with filters, too, after all.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hubzilla #CW #CWs #CWMeta #ContentWarning #ContentWarnings #ContentWarningMeta
I still wonder how people coming from Facebook are not able to find out about Friendica, Hubzilla and co, as their experience with Mastodon must be very unsatisfactory. But then again, most people have no media competence whatsoever.
Well, for one, Friendica and its descendants have never gone viral. It doesn't help that everything in the family prior to (streams) was made under the assumption of "if you build it, they will come". And especially Friendica was made in an era when phone apps were gimmicks rather than absolute necessities.
Hubzilla lived on Friendica converts most of the time because Friendica was just about the only place where Hubzilla was known at all. I guess most people who jumped ships from Friendica to Hubzilla did it for even more features they might need. This is also why nothing post-Hubzilla really took off: It was mostly known on Hubzilla, but just about all that Hubzilla users knew about it was that it had fewer features than Hubzilla. And people either didn't know or didn't care what was improved in comparison with Hubzilla.
Besides, nobody on Facebook expects there to be a free, decentralised Facebook alternative. And if they don't expect it, they don't Google for it, and they don't stumble upon it. If someone invites them to Mastodon, it's usually either a huge surprise that a free, decentralised alternative to anything exists, or they don't notice that Mastodon is free and/or decentralised.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Friendica #Hubzilla
But I don't understand why Mastodon is so popular.
In order to understand it, you have to go back to Mastodon's origins in 2016.
Mastodon was brand-new. It was somehow discovered by German press that a German lad almost fresh out of school had developed a "Twitter killer". Searing hot story in Germany which quickly spread beyond Germany.
There was also Pleroma, also from Germany, but Pleroma got nothing because it had made the mistake to position itself as an alternative Web UI for GNU social rather than direct stand-alone competition against Twitter.
There was also diaspora*, a Facebook alternative, but it was nothing but a distant memory of a crowdfunding campaign in summer 2010, in the wake of the Cambridge Analytica story, which raised $320,000 when $12,000 were the goal. But diaspora* itself wasn't released with a bang. Some six years later, it was still a public alpha, it was fairly lack-lustre, and the entire development team had to be replaced on the way. Most people had entirely forgotten about it, even tech journalists.
There were also GNU social (formerly StatusNet), Friendica and Hubzilla, but like Pleroma, the general public had never heard of them.
And so it seemed like this boy from Jena had made something that had never been done before, also because he had a ready-to-run software product and not a plan and a crowdfunding campaign.
Fast-forward to 2017. Certain fringe groups were chased off of Twitter: furries, otaku, LGBTQIA+. The only halfway Twitter-like place that at least some of them had heard of was Mastodon. So that was where they invited each other. Within no time,
#awoo was one of the hottest hashtags on Mastodon.It was especially then that Mastodon grew faster than anything else in the Fediverse.
Fast-forward to early 2022. Elon Musk had announced that he might buy Twitter. The first big Twitter migration wave was kicked off. And everyone who fled from Twitter into the Fediverse landed on Mastodon. Why Here are some reasons.
- There were many more Mastodon users who'd invite people to Mastodon than there were Pleroma users who'd invite people to Pleroma, and especially in the western world, there were far more than there were Misskey users who'd invite people to Misskey. Not to mention their respective forks or stuff that wasn't made to be a Twitter alternative.
- For simplicity reasons, Twitter escapees were never given the choice between Fediverse projects. Instead, they weren't even guided to the project websites but to certain instances, mostly mastodon.social. Not only because more choice would have overwhelmed the Twitter escapees more, but also because you can only tweet so much in 280 characters.
- Precious few Mastodon users even knew back then that there was more to the Fediverse than Mastodon, much less what there was. Thus, nobody on Mastodon invited anyone from Twitter to Calckey or so.
- It actually seemed like Pleroma, Akkoma and the westernised Forkeys slept through the migration wave because there weren't actually masses of people guided from Twitter to one of these.
- Neither of them really had that one big official lighthouse instance that could withstand a massive migration wave of hundreds of thousands or even millions of users. I guess their users were rather cautious. All this in spite of especially Pleroma and Akkoma requiring much fewer server resources than Mastodon. Only Misskey had and still has a lighthouse instance that a) can hold loads of users and b) with a domain that makes it look like this lighthouse instance is Misskey.
And so the Fediverse ended up with millions upon millions of people who initially thought that Mastodon, or even the Fediverse itself, was only mastodon.social. Or mstdn.social or mas.to if their inviters were too lazy to type on their phone screens. But most of the time, it was mastodon.social.
A typical Fediverse invite tweet looked like this back then:
join mastodon its twitter without musk
No link to joinmastodon.org. No mention of instances, much less other instances. And no mention of the rest of the Fediverse.
Well, and now that Mastodon makes for 70% of the Fediverse, and at least every other Mastodon user still doesn't know about the existence of a Fediverse outside of Mastodon, there are still more people trying to invite users to Mastodon than people trying to invite users to anything else in the Fediverse combined.
Tech media and mass media don't help either. Mastodon had a huge boom, but everything else in the Fediverse didn't. Thus, Mastodon was noticed by tech media and mass media, and everything else in the Fediverse wasn't. Thus, tech media and mass media only wrote about Mastodon, but hardly about the Fediverse itself and never at all about Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Calckey/Firefish, Sharkey, Iceshrimp etc. because they never even noticed that any of these exist. Thus, the general public read about Mastodon, but hardly about the Fediverse and not at all about anything else in the Fediverse. Thus, people only know Mastodon.
And now you have next to nobody on Pleroma trying to invite people from to Pleroma.
You have next to nobody on Akkoma trying to invite people from to Akkoma.
You have next to nobody on Iceshrimp trying to invite people from to Iceshrimp.
You have next to nobody on Sharkey trying to invite people from to Sharkey.
But you have loads of people on Mastodon trying to invite people from to Mastodon.
You have loads of people on Mastodon trying to invite people from Facebook to Mastodon because they've never even heard about the existence of Friendica, much less Hubzilla, (streams) or Socialhome.
You have loads of people on Mastodon trying to invite people from all kinds of commercial silos to Mastodon because Mastodon is all they've ever heard of, and besides, they try to race Bluesky in terms of user numbers.
When it comes to microblogging, we now have:
- Bluesky: the next Twitter. Also with easy onboarding because it's centralised. (Bluesky nerds: "Ackchually..." : "ACKCHUALLY...")
- Threads: Meta Platforms = Facebook = Zuckerberg = evil!1!!
- Nostr: Either you've never heard of it, or it's a playground for cryptobros by cryptobros.
- Mastodon: The only non-commercial alternative to the Birdcage known to mankind, but WAYYYYYY too complicated because you have to choose an instance! (Not like both joinmastodon.org and the official app railroad you to mastodon.social. Not like the official Bluesky app doesn't let you pick a PDS to join.)
- Pleroma: :personshrugging: Never heard of that.
- Akkoma: :personshrugging: Never heard of that.
- Misskey: only known in Japan.
- Firefish: :personshrugging: Never heard of that.
- Iceshrimp: :personshrugging: Never heard of that.
- Sharkey: :personshrugging: Never heard of that. Apparently, not even the 2SLGBTQIA+ community.
- Catodon: :personshrugging: Never heard of that.
- Mitra: :personshrugging: Never heard of that.
- And so forth...
In short: Mastodon is only so popular because nobody knows anything else. Its only advantage over the rest of the Fediverse is that many more people know it.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon Especially because they make it look like the Fediverse is a) Mastodon and b) all kinds of other stuff that actually doesn't really matter. As you've said, most of the time, they post about Mastodon and only Mastodon as if there's nothing else out there. Lumping everything that isn't Mastodon together, keeping it separate from Mastodon and only marginally touching it, if at all, makes it seem like the non-Mastodon Fediverse isn't worth bothering.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon
But there are loads of pictures out there if one searches. Three attached.
If one searches.
If one wants to search.
If one suspects there to be something else out there in the Fediverse.
But for many Mastodon users, the Fediverse is Mastodon and only Mastodon, and that's an absolutely undeniable fact. Set in stone. It couldn't possibly be any different. They don't even take into consideration that it could be any different. "Fediverse" is the name of the Mastodon network which is nothing but Mastodon and more Mastodon. Full stop.
Why else do so many Mastodon users use "Fediverse" and "Mastodon" mutually exchangeably or even out-right claim that the Fediverse is only Mastodon with such utter confidence
Why else does the revelation that something that isn't Mastodon is connected to Mastodon and claims its place in the Fediverse leave so many Mastodon users deranged enough to generously dish out mutes and blocks in an attempt to make the Fediverse only Mastodon again, or at least make it feel like it's still only Mastodon
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NotOnlyMastodon #FediverseIsNotMastodon #MastodonIsNotTheFediverse
Yes, Mastodon mimics the old Twitter in many ways, but I don't think that's at odds with the federation in the Fediverse Each platform has it's own concepts and quirks. As long as they can talk over AP, that's fine with me.
It isn't like everything that isn't Mastodon speaks with one tongue anyway.
A Friendica instance is called a node. A Hubzilla instance is called a hub. A Funkwhale instance is called a pod, and so is a diaspora* instance.
Mastodon has posts officially, but toots unofficially. Misskey and the Forkeys have notes.
Mastodon boosts. Misskey and the Forkeys renote. Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte repeat.
Mastodon may have quote-posts in the future, unofficially quote-toots. Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams) and Forte share instead.
Not to mention the various definitions of channels, communities etc.
Also, interestingly, in terms of UX, Misskey is actually closer to than Mastodon.
However, Mastodon now has such a large user base that other platforms feel pressure to adapt to Mastodon's quirks, such as some of its APIs. This can be problematic, especially if the Mastodon implementation is hacky or unclean.
Also, when you start adding non-standard, proprietary Mastodon stuff to your non-Mastodon project, you make your project dependent on Mastodon, and you allow Mastodon to at least partially assume control over your project.
EEE in the Fediverse is way past the second E now.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse No, it's rather because people don't know what's in the Fediverse and what isn't.
I mean, at least every other Mastodon user thinks the Fediverse equals Mastodon and only Mastodon.
Let's assume I mention my own Hubzilla channel somewhere in some context. I'll hit two obstacles. One, three out of four Fediverse users have never heard of Hubzilla, so how shall they assume that it's a Fediverse project if I don't explicitly tell them so Two, again, many think the Fediverse is only Mastodon, so how shall they assume that Hubzilla is in the Fediverse when it's completely unimaginable to them that there could be anything else in the Fediverse that isn't Mastodon
Also, especially on Mastodon, nobody can tell where my post is from. Next to nobody looks up any posts at their sources anyway. Mastodon doesn't show where a post came from, software-wise. And net everyone can tell from certain signs (what mentions look like, what hashtags look like) that something came from something that's very much not Mastodon. Only the very few who can be bothered to look at my post at its source will notice that it came from something that has "Hubzilla" written on top. For the majority, everything in their Mastodon timeline came from Mastodon.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #NotOnlyMastodonIf you write about something that's in the Fediverse but not Mastodon, most Fediverse users won't know that it's in the Fediverse.
Even if you write about e.g. your Hubzilla channel or your WriteFreely blog, hardly anyone will know that they can follow you there. Yes, even when you write about your Hubzilla channel from your Hubzilla channel. Especially Mastodon users won't know what Hubzilla is, they won't know that they can follow Hubzilla channels from Mastodon, and they'll assume that you've just posted from Mastodon.
So if you want people to know that whatever you're writing about is part of the Fediverse and connected to Mastodon, you have to explicitly mention both.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse They're available all over the Fediverse outside of Mastodon.
Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Calckey, Firefish, Iceshrimp, Iceshrimp.NET, Sharkey, Catodon, Neko, CherryPick, Meisskey, Tanukey, Mitra, Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams), Forte and others, they all have quote-posts readily available now. They're all in the Fediverse and federated with Mastodon. And yes, they can quote-post Mastodon toots right now.
CC:
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #QuotePost #QuotePosts #QuoteTweet #QuoteTweets #QuoteToot #QuoteToots #QuoteBoost #QuoteBoost #QuotedShares Hubzilla does federate with Mastodon. In case you haven't noticed, but I'm writing to you from Hubzilla. It just requires ActivityPub to be activated both on a hub level (it is by default) and on a channel level (it is not by default). So what I meant was that Hubzilla does not have the Mastodon client API implemented, and so you can't use Hubzilla with a Mastodon phone app.
But seriously, for one, Hubzilla is structurally so far away from Mastodon that this couldn't work anyway, I guess. I don't think the Mastodon client API could be bent in such a way that it works with an architecture that has multiple channels, multiple identities on the same login, not to mention that the Mastodon client API probably couldn't handle nomadic identity with its side-effects. Even if the Mastodon client API could, Mastodon apps couldn't because almost all of them are geared towards Mastodon and only Mastodon.
Which leads me to the second point: Even if you could connect Hubzilla to a Mastodon phone app, you couldn't even use 5% of Hubzilla's features because almost all Mastodon phone apps only cover Mastodon's features, and I guess that some of those apps which already existed in 2022 still only cover Mastodon 3's features.
This is far from "better than nothing". Apart from people who have only just switched from Mastodon to Hubzilla still with Twitter on the brain, nobody on Hubzilla would refer to such massive limitations as "better than nothing". Besides, not being able to use an app is not "nothing". Hubzilla is one of the few Fediverse server applications that can be installed as a Progressive Web App. And if that doesn't work, you can use it in a browser. In other words, there's always the Web UI.
Just about all Hubzilla veterans would vastly prefer the Web UI over not being able to use text formatting (not possible on Mastodon), not being able to embed images in a post (not possible on Mastodon), not being able to add alt-text to images (works vastly different on Mastodon), not being able to add titles to posts (not possible on Mastodon) and not even being able to select a channel on their account that isn't the default (Mastodon doesn't have channels either). And that's only the tip of the iceberg.
One of the reasons why there isn't a Hubzilla phone app with a fully native mobile UI is because this UI would have to be absolutely massive. The app would end up more complex than FairEmail. A good app should offer all the same features as the Web UI. But Hubzilla itself is fully geared towards the desktop, feature-wise, handling-wise and in its philosophy. Don't forget that Hubzilla was not made as a Twitter replacement.
Lastly, neither Mario Vavti nor Harald Eilertsen is willing to add more proprietary, non-standard, Mastodon-exclusive technology to Hubzilla than absolutely necessary, if at all. And a client API that's made for something completely and utterly different from Hubzilla and that won't even work properly with Hubzilla is far from "absolutely necessary". Hubzilla rather indulges in independence from Mastodon.
#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #MastodonAPI #MastodonApps #Hubzilla Zumal in mehrererlei Hinsicht das Fediverse hufig mit Mastodon gleichgesetzt wird.
Es ist ja weit berwiegend auf Mastodon, wo zum einen versucht wird, die Grenzen des Fediverse mglichst eng abzustecken und alles, was nicht als Fediverse angesehen wird, auszuschlieen. Auf Friendica, dessen Bestreben ja die Fderation mit allem Mglichen und Unmglichen ist, gibt's das schon kulturell so gar nicht. Aber wenn man das Fediverse als praktisch nur Mastodon ansieht, bemerkt man das nicht.
Und zum anderen ziehen viele auf Mastodon die Grenze des Fediverse genau um Mastodon herum. Entweder wissen sie gar nicht, was das Fediverse sonst so zu bieten hat. Oder, eher seltener, sie haben schon davon gehrt oder es sogar selbst mitbekommen, wollen aber so Sachen wie Friendica, Pleroma, Misskey usw. nicht im Fediverse haben, weil die zu sehr nicht Mastodon sind.
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#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #LangerPost #CWLangerPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Fediverse #Mastodon #NichtNurMastodon
Dolphins In Depth: Dolphins cant drop ball against Patriots
Und genau von daher ist es gut, da das Fediverse nicht so riesengro ist.Der Vogelkfig ist voll mit Selbstdarstellern, denen es nur darauf ankommt, ihre geistigen Ergsse (plus jede Menge Geklautes) an mglichst viele Leute rauszuposaunen, um sich dann was einbilden zu knnen auf ihre Followerzahlen und ihre Reichweite. An Interaktion sind sie eh nicht interessiert, nur an Fame.
Weil sie hier nicht binnen Stunden hunderttausende Follower bekommen knnen, bleiben sie hier von Natur aus weg.
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Weit Du, es ist wie im echten Leben auch. Wenn man nicht in der Lage ist eine Software, ein Tool oder eine Community zu verstehen, dann sind immer die anderen Schuld. Immer!
Aber niemals ist man selber Schuld, wenn man etwas nicht verstehen will.
Das ist doch stndig so. Jemand kommt neu in eine schon lngst etablierte Community oder Szene und versteht die nicht, schiebt das aber darauf, da alles ja so kompliziert ist. Das mu eher so und so und so sein, das findet der Neuling sehr viel einfacher.
Falls dem jetzt jemand beipflichten will und sagt, wieso, das ist doch gut: Wenn alles nach dem Gusto dieses Neulings umgebaut wird, kommt kurze Zeit spter der nchste Neuling, der das nicht versteht und wiederum alles nach seinem Geschmack umgebaut haben will.
brigens haben Normies, die sich einer bestehenden Community anschlossen, aber keinen Bock hatten, sich einzugliedern, auf diese Weise schon so manch ein Fandom und so manch eine Community zu Fall gebracht, indem sie ganz einfach irgendwann die Mehrheit stellten.
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Was mich aber am meisten abgenervt hat, dass sind die sogenannten "Regeln des Fediverse", von denen ich noch nie im Leben gehrt habe (meinen ersten Account habe ich in 2008 angelegt). Du MUSST eine CW setzen, es heit Trt, alles was lnger als 500 Zeichen ist, gehrt in ein Blog und weitere dmliche Vorgaben.
Und genau die kommen von den Leuten, fr die das Fediverse entweder ausschlielich aus Mastodon besteht oder ausschlielich aus Mastodon bestehen sollte.
Das tut es brigens nicht. Ich hoffe, das liest du jetzt nicht nach zweieinhalb Jahren zum allerersten Mal, aber das Fediverse ist nicht nur Mastodon. Der eine User, auf den du geantwortet hast, ist auf Friendica und nicht auf Mastodon. Und ich antworte dir von Hubzilla.
Und so leid es mir tut, aber einige der Anmerkungen waren durchaus gerechtfertigt, wenngleich sie dir vielleicht etwas sehr oberlehrerhaft oder gar bergriffig vorkamen.
Tatsache ist: Nicht jeder im Fediverse trtet. Denn nicht jeder im Fediverse ist auf Mastodon. Friendica, wo ist, ist nicht Mastodon. Hubzilla, wo ich bin, ist auch nicht Mastodon. Beide sind zwar im Fediverse und mit Mastodon verbunden, haben aber mit Mastodon nicht das Geringste zu tun, sie sind vllig anders als Mastodon und sind auch nicht nachtrglich an Mastodon drangebaut worden, sondern tatschlich sogar lter als Mastodon.
Folglich trten die Nutzer auf Friendica und Hubzilla nicht, ebensowenig wie die Nutzer von Pleroma, Akkoma, Misskey, Calckey, Firefish, CherryPick, Iceshrimp, Sharkey, Catodon, Mitra, GoToSocial, Socialhome, micro.blog, (streams), Forte usw. usf. Die sind aber auch alle im Fediverse, und die sind (fast) alle mit Mastodon verbunden.
Tatsache ist auch: Das Fediverse-Projekt, also die Serveranwendung, die du nutzt, die heit zwar Mastodon. Aber das ganze Netzwerk heit eben nicht Mastodon. Wie Der Pepe (Hubzilla) aus gegebenem Anla auf seinem Blog schrieb und auf seinem Kanal PepeCyB's Welt (beides auf Hubzilla, aber sehr wohl Teil des Fediverse) verteilte: ""
Wer auch immer dich da korrigiert hat, noch dazu auf eine Art und Weise, die dich verwirrt haben drfte, hat sich vermutlich ganz einfach daran gestrt, da du zwar mglicherweise das ganze Fediverse gemeint hast, es aber als "Mastodon" bezeichnet hast.
Nicht ffentlich zu antworten, scheint mir wiederum der Versuch zu sein, etwas durchzusetzen, wovon irgendjemand glaubt, es sei Teil der Fediquette und der Mastodon-Kultur. Denn auch wenn das auf Mastodon noch ginge: Je weiter man sich im Fediverse von Mastodon entfernt, desto weniger ist das berhaupt mglich.
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Last updated: 2024-12-04
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